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Old 04-25-2011, 03:51 PM  
keg in kc keg in kc is offline
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Game of Thrones (spoiler-free zone)

A few have suggested it, might as well test the waters. The idea is to give people who haven't read the books a safe place to talk about the show.

A few quick ground rules:
  • No Spoilers!!!!! for upcoming episodes.
  • Larger Song of Ice and Fire discussion should be limited to the other thread although I think a tiny bit of book delving to fill in holes should be okay (example of this would be talking about Catelyn and her treatment of the wolves in the novel, which was alluded to on TV but never really made clear...)
  • Everything that happened that week is fair game once an episode airs. So if you don't watch on Sunday night, I'd stay outta here until you do...
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Old 04-21-2014, 07:10 PM   #1741
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Almost done with episode one and good. grief. its already becoming cloudy.

So, Sean Beans Lord of Winterfell, right hand man and ex brother in law of the King of wherever, is marrying his daughter to the Kings son, who eventually goes on to be the snot nosed and evil boy King in season two.

Sean Beans Lord also faked an ambush of his own Ranger Patrol by the "tall white ones"... to what end I can only guess.

The blonde girl forced into an arranged marriage by her brother so they can use her new husbands army to cross the Narrow Sea and retake their old kingdom is HAWTER THAN HELL.

Dinklage is a "drunken lecher" and brother of the Queen of "wherever" who's son is marrying Beans daughter... and, and hooo boy, glad I didn't try to drink and watch this.

But I totally get why this is so popular, its as well done as any movie... oh, and just now Dinklages normal sized brother just got caught smashing the Queen.

Good grief.
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Old 04-21-2014, 07:22 PM   #1742
Aries Walker Aries Walker is offline
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Advice: Try to think of them as their character names, not 'Sean Bean' or 'Dinklage's normal sized brother'. The names are (usually) fairly familiar-looking, and the family names come into play. A lot.

I could type them all out, but here's a better idea, and spoiler-free. Of course, you won't meet some of these characters for a few episodes, but whatever.

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Old 04-21-2014, 07:25 PM   #1743
KcMizzou KcMizzou is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scott free View Post
Almost done with episode one and good. grief. its already becoming cloudy.

So, Sean Beans Lord of Winterfell, right hand man and ex brother in law of the King of wherever, is marrying his daughter to the Kings son, who eventually goes on to be the snot nosed and evil boy King in season two.

Sean Beans Lord also faked an ambush of his own Ranger Patrol by the "tall white ones"... to what end I can only guess.

The blonde girl forced into an arranged marriage by her brother so they can use her new husbands army to cross the Narrow Sea and retake their old kingdom is HAWTER THAN HELL.

Dinklage is a "drunken lecher" and brother of the Queen of "wherever" who's son is marrying Beans daughter... and, and hooo boy, glad I didn't try to drink and watch this.

But I totally get why this is so popular, its as well done as any movie... oh, and just now Dinklages normal sized brother just got caught smashing the Queen.

Good grief.
Oh hell.
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Old 04-21-2014, 07:27 PM   #1744
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Many thanks Aries, the season two box set I tried out had a foldout insert very similar but not quite as detailed.
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Old 04-21-2014, 07:32 PM   #1745
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Originally Posted by KcMizzou View Post
Oh hell.
I'm tryin
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Old 04-21-2014, 07:34 PM   #1746
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Originally Posted by scott free View Post
I'm tryin
Hang in there man. It really will get easier.

I have the benefit of not only the books, but I've seen seasons 1-3 three times. (They're that good.)

Just dive into it. You'll figure it all out as it goes along.
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Old 04-21-2014, 07:51 PM   #1747
KcMizzou KcMizzou is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scott free View Post
Almost done with episode one and good. grief. its already becoming cloudy.

So, Sean Beans Lord of Winterfell, right hand man and ex brother in law of the King of wherever, is marrying his daughter to the Kings son, who eventually goes on to be the snot nosed and evil boy King in season two.

That's Eddard Stark aka Ned. The king is Robert Baratheon. He's the King of Westeros aka the Seven Kingdoms. They're old buddies. Grew up like brothers, and fought in a war together.

Sean Beans Lord also faked an ambush of his own Ranger Patrol by the "tall white ones"... to what end I can only guess.

That wasn't faked. The men at the wall are sworn to protect the south. Desertion is punishable by death. Ned Stark is an honorable man, and believes if he sentences a man to death, he has to swing the sword himself.

The blonde girl forced into an arranged marriage by her brother so they can use her new husbands army to cross the Narrow Sea and retake their old kingdom is HAWTER THAN HELL.

You got that right.

Dinklage is a "drunken lecher" and brother of the Queen of "wherever" who's son is marrying Beans daughter... and, and hooo boy, glad I didn't try to drink and watch this.

That's Tyrion Lannister, and he's the dwarven brother of the queen Cersei, Robert Baratheon's wife

But I totally get why this is so popular, its as well done as any movie... oh, and just now Dinklages normal sized brother just got caught smashing the Queen.

Good grief.
Just FYI

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Old 04-21-2014, 07:53 PM   #1748
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Originally Posted by keg in kc View Post
I didn't interpret that comment as a joke at all.

This is the original scene from the novel:And that's where the show stopped following the novel, which went on to add thisI'll cut off there, because I think there's a chance that elements of the conversation they had immediately after shows up later this season.)

I think they tried to infer that consentual part of it with her gripping the altar cloth, I think that was them trying to denote passion, but they sure didn't include the rest of what was spoken.

And maybe because it wouldn't have mattered in the end, had they added that part, since we've evolved to understand that that 'no means no' and you stop as soon as you hear it. I think it's safe to assume that people may have reacted even more negatively to that encounter had she said no, he continued anyway, and then she ended up begging him to **** her. That's a risky message to put on tape, even if the setting is in a brutal pseudo medieval setting, and I think there would have been outrage over that, too.

Hard scene to watch in any case.
So you don't think a guy who wrote about a brother and sister ****ing next to their dead son isn't joking when he said I wouldn't even write that ****ed up stuff. I think it was a total joke.
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Old 04-21-2014, 08:02 PM   #1749
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that DOES help KCMizzou.
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Old 04-21-2014, 08:04 PM   #1750
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Originally Posted by scott free View Post
that DOES help KCMizzou.
Cool. I tried not to spoil anything, but now you've got the basics.
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Old 04-22-2014, 07:28 AM   #1751
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that DOES help KCMizzou.
Scott, This guy writes a "scorecard" for every Game of Thrones episode that is intended to help non-book readers understand what is going on better without providing any spoilers. These are very helpful in understanding all the characters and a little of the background info and history of Westeros that is harder to get in a show than by reading the books.

If you read the scorecard after each episode, I think it will catch you up to speed a lot easier and a lot faster than trying to just figure it all out on your own by watching and paying attention. All of the scorecards for each season are archived at this site linked below, I recommend spending 5 minutes after each episode to read the scorecard to help your understanding of everything.

Link: http://gotscorecards.us
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Old 04-22-2014, 07:34 AM   #1752
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As an example, here is the scorecard for episode 1 of season 1 that you just watched:

Season 1 Episode 1: "Winter Is Coming"
Main characters:

House Stark - Eddard Stark is the Lord of Winterfell and Warden of the North. He is a longtime friend of the king (Robert Baratheon), and in fact helped the king get his throne. He married Catelyn Tully, and they had 5 kids. Robb is the oldest, followed by Sansa (redhead), Arya (tomboy), Bran (boy who loves to climb), and Rickon. Eddard had a sister, Lyanna, who was promised to the king, and as you saw in the pilot, the king still loves her. Eddard also had a brother who died. The other young man in the family is Jon Snow. Jon is of Stark blood, but because he's a bastard in the North, he is given the surname of Snow - the custom for illegitimate children is to carry a surname that indicates what part of the country they are from (other examples - Stone, Rivers). Another Stark is Benjen, Ned's only living sibling and the Commander of the Night's Watch, the force that mans that giant wall you saw at the beginning of the show. The Night's Watch protects the kingdom from the "Wildlings" - who are men and women that for one reason or another abandoned the kingdom to go live beyond the Wall, and from the "White Walkers" - who many believe are myth, and who you don't need to dwell on too much at this point.

House Arryn - Jon Arryn was the Warden of the East and the Hand of the King (basically the Chief of Staff). Unfortunately, the only time you see Jon in the pilot is with painted rocks over his eyes, because he's dead of a fever. Jon was the mentor for King Robert and Eddard (aka Ned). He was married to Catelyn's sister Lysa, and they have a son. In episode 1, Lysa sent a letter to Catelyn stating that Jon was murdered.

House Lannister - this is the wealthiest and perhaps most power-hungry family in Westeros (and that's saying something). Tywin Lannister is the patriarch, though we haven't met him yet. He has three children - the twins Cersei and Jaime, and the dwarf Tyrion. While the king was off hunting, Bran witnessed Cersei and Jaime getting it on, which is why Jaime pushed Bran off the wall.

House Targaryen - this is the family that used to hold the Iron Throne. Robert, Jon Arryn, Ned and others overthrew the family. Viserys and Daenerys were spirited away as children, and Viserys is consumed with the idea of getting the family's throne back. That's why Viserys is willing to give his sister to Khal Drogo, who is the lord of the horsepeople called the Dothraki. The Dothraki aren't going to give you the cultural arts, but they eat, sleep and breathe battle.

House Baratheon - Robert the king is the head of the house. He has a couple of brothers that we'll meet soon, as well. Robert, as mentioned, loved Lyanna Stark, but with her death (and the need to continue the royal line) he was wed to Cersei Lannister. The royal children are Joffrey (blond kid that Sansa was making googly eyes at), Myrcella, and Tommen.

Other folks you met that will play increasingly important roles:
- Theon Greyjoy: he was the guy who put a knife to the wolf puppy when they first found them. He is a ward of Ned Stark.

- Jorah Mormont: he was the guy who gave Daenerys the books.

- Illyrio: He is the guy who is the go-between for Viserys/Daenerys and Khal Drogo.

- The Hound - you weren't really introduced to him, but he was the guy wearing the helmet that looked like a dog's head. I think he was also the guy who appeared briefly and looked like he had been partially scalped. He is the main bodyguard to Joffrey. He's a badass and a sonofabitch, but he's got nothing on his brother (not yet introduced) in either department.

So now we've got some nasty stuff brewing. Jon Arryn is dead...maybe murdered; Ned is his successor as the Hand of the King. Ned's chock full o' integrity, but King's Landing (the capital) is subtle in its politics, and Ned is a fairly straightforward guy. Jaime and Cersei are up to no good and just threw the son of the new Hand from a high place. Viserys is on the brink of raising an army of horselords that could sweep up the seven kingdoms. It's just going to get more intricate from here
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Old 04-22-2014, 01:44 PM   #1753
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Agreed, its the most convoluted thing I've tried to get into, I'm used to highly involved dramas with all kinds of shifting loyalties/storylines like Deadwood, the Sopranos etc... but this one takes the cake.

If starting from the very beginning doesn't work, nothing will.
You actually need to watch season 1, two or three times.. It takes a bit to learn all the characters for those that have not read the books.
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Old 04-22-2014, 03:48 PM   #1754
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Originally Posted by Aries Walker View Post
Advice: Try to think of them as their character names, not 'Sean Bean' or 'Dinklage's normal sized brother'. The names are (usually) fairly familiar-looking, and the family names come into play. A lot.

I could type them all out, but here's a better idea, and spoiler-free. Of course, you won't meet some of these characters for a few episodes, but whatever.

This reminds me that Benjen Stark is still out there. A reasonable assumption would be that he's dead considering all the dangers in the North, but I doubt it. He's probably going to pop up at some point.
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Old 04-22-2014, 03:55 PM   #1755
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BTW, is there some greater mystery about Lyanna Stark being taken by Rhaegar and her death after that? Did she actually go with him willingly? That entire situation has never been fully explained, but Rhaegar has actually been talked about favorably by some of the characters throughout the series (obviously not by Robert Baratheon in S1).

Perhaps I don't actually want the answer to that, though. If there even is an answer yet.
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