Chiefs Sutton's Defense Won't Dictate Or Attack - Page 4

**petegz28** · 08-17-2018, 06:39 PM

His defense lacks any sense of toughness and attack. He doesn't dictate anything. When he blitzes he blitzes to blitz and not to dictate what the ofense can and cannot do.

Take Wade Phillips on the other hand. The guy instantly upgrades any defense he coaches regardless of talent. Why? Because he has a defense that dictactes what an offense must do. Not sit back trying to defend against any and everything possible.

Preseason or not, toughness and an attacking mentality are something that shows regardless. Sutton's defenses are soft, reactionary and undisciplined.

How this guy still has a job bogles the minds of most. But I am afraid what we've seen the last few years is what we will see again. Minimal attack, dependency on a turnover. Lots of time on the field defensively.

chiefzilla1501 · 08-17-2018, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eleazar

Sutton and the defense are emblematic of Andy Reid's inability to change

True. But also not true.

I think Andy refuses to change here because he's too loyal to Sutton. I don't think he's stuck on a D philosophy. Change the coordinator and I'd bet he'd let the next D coordinator do whatever he wanted to.

**petegz28** · 08-17-2018, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTG#10

Bullshit. We're showing the same thing we show during every season since Sutton has been here. Andy is a liar trying to cover for his buddy's incompetence. Same old same old year in and year out. Sutton is trash and will always be trash.

I have a buddy who us a huge Jets fan. He told me from day one we would regret having Sutton. Right now I think he is right. Sutton has his moments of wanting to play a good defense but then drops back into a shell where he tries to defend everything, every play. All that does is make you reactionary and indecisive.

**petegz28** · 08-17-2018, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

True. But also not true.

I think Andy refuses to change here because he's too loyal to Sutton. I don't think he's stuck on a D philosophy. Change the coordinator and I'd bet he'd let the next D coordinator do whatever he wanted to.

Totally agree with that. I should clarify I don't think Reid is loyal to the D philosophy but to the D Coordinator

chiefzilla1501 · 08-17-2018, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTG#10

Bullshit. We're showing the same thing we show during every season since Sutton has been here. Andy is a liar trying to cover for his buddy's incompetence. Same old same old year in and year out. Sutton is trash and will always be trash.

It's the preseason. We always show an ultra vanilla defense. Again, I'm not that confident Sutton can make this work. But it's very common for defenses to be extremely vanilla and unaggressive in the preseason.

And I disagree that Sutton has always been trash. He had a few good years but the game seems to have passed him by. I sure hope I'm wrong about that.

htismaqe · 08-17-2018, 07:13 PM

It’s amazing to me how much people here overrate coaching. Greg Robinson has a Super Bowl ring. Everybody’s 90’s hero Gunther coached one of the worst Chiefs defenses I’ve ever seen. It’s like people don’t actually watch the games.

Players make plays, period. When Houston was on, Sutton’s defense was top 5 in scoring. If Veach did his job, the defense will be better with or without Sutton.

**petegz28** · 08-17-2018, 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by htismaqe

It’s amazing to me how much people here overrate coaching. Greg Robinson has a Super Bowl ring. Everybody’s 90’s hero Gunther coached one of the worst Chiefs defenses I’ve ever seen. It’s like people don’t actually watch the games.

Players make plays, period. When Houston was on, Sutton’s defense was top 5 in scoring. If Veach did his job, the defense will be better with or without Sutton.

I would normally agree. Right up until Sutton called Houston to cover Antonio Brown instead of rushing the QB....then it all became clear

htismaqe · 08-17-2018, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

It's the preseason. We always show an ultra vanilla defense. Again, I'm not that confident Sutton can make this work. But it's very common for defenses to be extremely vanilla and unaggressive in the preseason.

And I disagree that Sutton has always been trash. He had a few good years but the game seems to have passed him by. I sure hope I'm wrong about that.

Passed him by? An aging DJ that neither Pioli nor Dorsey could replace, a gimpy Houston, multiple stints on IR for Berry. The defense’s struggles aren’t a mystery.

MTG#10 · 08-17-2018, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by htismaqe

It’s amazing to me how much people here overrate coaching. Greg Robinson has a Super Bowl ring. Everybody’s 90’s hero Gunther coached one of the worst Chiefs defenses I’ve ever seen. It’s like people don’t actually watch the games.

Players make plays, period. When Houston was on, Sutton’s defense was top 5 in scoring. If Veach did his job, the defense will be better with or without Sutton.

I'll agree with this to an extent, but you seem to greatly underrate defensive scheme.

Best22 · 08-17-2018, 07:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by -King-

They've also allowed 43, 48, and 38 point games.
Posted via Mobile Device

Wade Phillips didn't become their defensive coach until 2015, the year they won the Super Bowl

When they allowed those point totals, Del Rio was their DC

-King- · 08-17-2018, 07:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by petegz28

I would normally agree. Right up until Sutton called Houston to cover Antonio Brown instead of rushing the QB....then it all became clear

Maybe just maybe there was a miscommunication within the players and they didn't call a switch and that's why that happened. You really think Sutton really had Houston covering him from the get go?
Posted via Mobile Device

htismaqe · 08-17-2018, 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by petegz28

I would normally agree. Right up until Sutton called Houston to cover Antonio Brown instead of rushing the QB....then it all became clear

So rush Houston and let Brown run free? Come on, Pete. You’re smarter than that. People want aggression but they don’t realize that today’s NFL is geared towards protecting QBs. There’s egregious holding on nearly every play. Houston hasn’t been himself for a couple of years. Sending him on that play was just asking to get burnt.

**petegz28** · 08-17-2018, 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by -King-

Maybe just maybe there was a miscommunication within the players and they didn't call a switch and that's why that happened. You really think Sutton really had Houston covering him from the get go?
Posted via Mobile Device

Yes. Considering it happened twice, yes. You don't have a miscommunication that causes your best pass rusher to cover the best WR in the NFL 50+ yards downfield. Or again on the final play of the game on 3rd & 7 when you have to have a stop.

bricks · 08-17-2018, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RunKC

Can we at least wait until we aren’t running vanilla gameplans in games that don’t matter to determine this?

Good god pete

He’s right though

Gameplans or not

I get what he is saying. Its the same shitty patterns were accustomed to seeing since he has been def coordinator here

Eleazar · 08-17-2018, 07:20 PM

Houston isn't an elite pass rusher anymore. The defense is going to have to come up with some other answers.

**petegz28** · 08-17-2018, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by htismaqe

So rush Houston and let Brown run free? Come on, Pete. You’re smarter than that. People want aggression but they don’t realize that today’s NFL is geared towards protecting QBs. There’s egregious holding on nearly every play. Houston hasn’t been himself for a couple of years. Sending him on that play was just asking to get burnt.

WTF are you even making any assumption that rushing Houston allows Brown to run free? If that's the case you're ****ed from the get go on your play call. Which is exactly my point.

08-17-2018, 06:39 PM
petegz28 Supporter Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Olathe, Ks Casino cash: $2834127	Sutton's Defense Won't Dictate Or Attack His defense lacks any sense of toughness and attack. He doesn't dictate anything. When he blitzes he blitzes to blitz and not to dictate what the ofense can and cannot do. Take Wade Phillips on the other hand. The guy instantly upgrades any defense he coaches regardless of talent. Why? Because he has a defense that dictactes what an offense must do. Not sit back trying to defend against any and everything possible. Preseason or not, toughness and an attacking mentality are something that shows regardless. Sutton's defenses are soft, reactionary and undisciplined. How this guy still has a job bogles the minds of most. But I am afraid what we've seen the last few years is what we will see again. Minimal attack, dependency on a turnover. Lots of time on the field defensively.
Posts: 127,981

08-17-2018, 07:13 PM	#50
htismaqe 'Tis my eye! Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Chiefsplanet Casino cash: $10269900	It’s amazing to me how much people here overrate coaching. Greg Robinson has a Super Bowl ring. Everybody’s 90’s hero Gunther coached one of the worst Chiefs defenses I’ve ever seen. It’s like people don’t actually watch the games. Players make plays, period. When Houston was on, Sutton’s defense was top 5 in scoring. If Veach did his job, the defense will be better with or without Sutton.
Posts: 100,022

08-17-2018, 07:20 PM	#59
Eleazar Beyond the Rapids Join Date: May 2003 Location: Langley, VA Casino cash: $-370000	Houston isn't an elite pass rusher anymore. The defense is going to have to come up with some other answers.
Posts: 80,659	1 0