Why aren't we happy with the safety position heading into 2019?

[Direckshun]

We just signed Mathieu, who's awesome.

I know nobody likes Sorensen's cap number, but I think he's worth it -- he's starting-caliber. He picked off Brady and stopped a 4th and 1 in the AFCCG.

Armani Watts obviously is an injury concern but all safeties are injury concerns, and Watts showed well before he went down.

Jordan Lucas looks really solid.

I don't like Eric Murray so I don't care there, but we're pretty solid at safety, as much as we are any position on the defense. We don't need to spend $12m on Earl Thomas or burn a 1st or 2nd day pick on the position.

Remember the goal: the goal is to get the defense to be league-average while the offense destroys people.

Our safety position right now is league average.

Let's invest in the positions we are less than league average at: corner, passrusher, linebacker. Basically everywhere else on the defense except for safety.

[chiefforlife]

Last year we thought we were pretty set at safety and then we lost Berry, Sorenson and Watts right out of the gate.
Not saying that will happen again but adding more talent is never a bad thing.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by Detoxing

I don't buy this idea that there's only 3 LB's in this entire class worth a shit.

Most likely, as fans, we simply don't have all the information.

It's a position group that can be upgraded. And will be upgraded. It needs to be. It's the weakest group we have.

Maybe it doesn't even come through the draft.

Sam 'backers. Not all linebackers.

Guys specifically suited for my understanding of what Spags is likely to do. Now he may go a completely different direction with that position, but the Wilson pickup suggests probably not.

If you can find more than 3 viable long-term starters at Sam 'backer, be my guest. There are Wills, though. And interior 3-4 ILBs; Derron Lee or Reggie Ragland types on both sides of the spectrum. But every down 4-3 MLBs and multi-purpose Sam backers are just damn sparse in this draft and I'd welcome anyone to show me otherwise.

Because I damn sure didn't expect it to be this bad when I first started looking into the position group. I think our best bet is to due something like the Saints have done with Anzalone and take one of those hybrid S/LBs and try to bulk him up to play the middle.

But no, we as fans never have complete information. Not as to the prospects or even as to the schemes themselves. It's all guesswork and it's possible the coaching staff has a trick up its sleeve that we just don't see.

Doesn't mean we can't speculate just for shits and giggles. If we weren't doing that, it would be pretty boring 'round here during the offseason.

[oldman]

I think we have a bigger need at S and CB than LB. I think Hitchens was tentative last year as a 3-4 ILB. Put him back in a 4-3 and he'll be OK. We have DOD, Wilson, and Ben Nieman, so we don't have to trot Ragland out there as often. Running a 4-3 takes some of the pressure off the LBs to be the first point of contact.

[O.city]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Sam 'backers. Not all linebackers.

Guys specifically suited for my understanding of what Spags is likely to do. Now he may go a completely different direction with that position, but the Wilson pickup suggests probably not.

If you can find more than 3 viable long-term starters at Sam 'backer, be my guest. There are Wills, though. And interior 3-4 ILBs; Derron Lee or Reggie Ragland types on both sides of the spectrum. But every down 4-3 MLBs and multi-purpose Sam backers are just damn sparse in this draft and I'd welcome anyone to show me otherwise.

Because I damn sure didn't expect it to be this bad when I first started looking into the position group. I think our best bet is to due something like the Saints have done with Anzalone and take one of those hybrid S/LBs and try to bulk him up to play the middle.

But no, we as fans never have complete information. Not as to the prospects or even as to the schemes themselves. It's all guesswork and it's possible the coaching staff has a trick up its sleeve that we just don't see.

Doesn't mean we can't speculate just for shits and giggles. If we weren't doing that, it would be pretty boring 'round here during the offseason.

Couldn't you do that with DOD?

[UChieffyBugger]

Because we've only got Honey Badger and a bunch of guys who simply aren't good enough. Didn't we learn anything from last year? Sorensen is trash, Murray is average, Lucas is good depth but nothing more and Watts, sadly, appears to be injury prone. We desperately need a veteran safety because by the time we pick most of the best safeties are likely to be off the board and no-one In the draft looks like they will be elite anyway. Why Veach hasn't moved for Tre Boston already is anyone's guess. He made that mistake last season and we paid for it, he better learn from that now. His draft last season was a massive failure but Sutton was the fall guy last season. Brett can't live off banging the table for Mahomes forever.

[Best22]

Originally Posted by O.city

I think the bigger need than LB'ers is athletes in the secondary that can cover. Corners, safeties etc.

Our LBs poor coverage hurt our defense pretty bad

[Rasputin]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

I think you are, in fact, in the minority.

I wanted to like Murray. Man I wanted to see him take a step forward because the physical tools are there.

But what you see as a lack of confidence I see as a lack of savvy/awareness. The guy just doesn't look like this game comes naturally to him at all. At this stage in the game, if you're still thinking through the snaps, I think it's fairly unlikely that a light bulb just turns on.

I wouldn't be crushed to see them give him another shot, but with a $3 million cap savings from cutting him, I wouldn't be upset to see him let go either.

It wouldn't hurt my feelings if he got cut I just want to see him get a shot with new coaching staff and see if that was indeed the bigger problem but he has talent. The smarts maybe in question but I want to see if he can still step it up. If we can upgrade in the draft of course I'm cool with that but our defense still needs overhauled but Veach is on it.

Murray was available where Eric Berry was not.

[Iconic]

Sorensen is not worth his paycheck. He's abysmal in run defense, I'm talking one of the worst safeties in the league at it. In coverage he's barely got his head above water. Add on he looked half a step slower last year and you can safely assume he'll only get worse. You can find better production at this spot for a cheaper price in Lucas.

Murray is literal trash. His career passer rating allowed is almost 104. PFF gave him a coverage grade of ****ing 46.7 last year. I don't even know why this dudes been on the roster - oh wait I do Sutton.

Watts is a giant question mark. There's potential but we know absolutely so little about him and how he will come back from his injury. You can't rest your Superbowl hopes on a question mark.

Lucas is good depth. Keep him.

If you cut the first two that leaves you with 3 guys. Either way we need one more safety to pair with Mathieu, ideally a legitimate free safety who can roam up top while the Badger wrecks havoc down low. Get it through the draft or FA, but you have to get one.

[ModSocks]

Originally Posted by UChieffyBugger

Because we've only got Honey Badger and a bunch of guys who simply aren't good enough. Didn't we learn anything from last year? Sorensen is trash, Murray is average, Lucas is good depth but nothing more and Watts, sadly, appears to be injury prone. We desperately need a veteran safety because by the time we pick most of the best safeties are likely to be off the board and no-one In the draft looks like they will be elite anyway. Why Veach hasn't moved for Tre Boston already is anyone's guess. He made that mistake last season and we paid for it, he better learn from that now. His draft last season was a massive failure but Sutton was the fall guy last season. Brett can't live off banging the table for Mahomes forever.

At this point it's time to accept that Tre Boston simply isn't as good as CP thinks.

The dude didn't land a contract till mid-camp last season and no one has even sniffed around him yet this year.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by O.city

Couldn't you do that with DOD?

I think you could try but I don't know that he has the frame to do it. You're talking about adding, what, 35 lbs of weight? He's a hair north of 200 lbs, right? Really slight dude for a LB.

Anzalone was something like 225 coming out of college. He was built to put on a little more weight and not lose his speed. I don't see that in O'Daniel.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by O.city

Couldn't you do that with DOD?

Think more along the lines of Terrill Hanks or Vosean Joseph. Probably too much of an ask for Gary Johnson or Ben Burr-Kirven but not impossible.

And then there's my boy Khalil Hodge but he might just be maxed; more weight there probably slows him up quite a bit. As a Domer I could try to sell you on Dru Tranquill but he's probably Hitchens if everything goes well. Pretty smart player (who again played some DB) but with his knee injuries and at 24, I just don't think there's enough athleticism left or time to get him over the hump. Which is damn disappointing because before the injury I would've told you that he had a shot to be similar to Jaylon Smith. Before the knee injuries, that kid could fly.

There are some athletic Will prospects out there who deserve mention but who just don't look able to make the transition to Sam and who need a fair amount more work to get to a Mike. But unfortunately, with the state of the position and the helium behind your boy Bush, I think that's the only shot you've got at a real long-term starting MLB from this draft unless you're willing to play the matchup game.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by Detoxing

At this point it's time to accept that Tre Boston simply isn't as good as CP thinks.

The dude didn't land a contract till mid-camp last season and no one has even sniffed around him yet this year.

CP writ large doesn't think he's that good.

I think that's just Crow.

[Mulliganman]

Originally Posted by Detoxing

At this point it's time to accept that Tre Boston simply isn't as good as CP thinks.

The dude didn't land a contract till mid-camp last season and no one has even sniffed around him yet this year.

I'm not sure how good Boston would be. But, what matters is if he better than what we currently have.

[UChieffyBugger]

Originally Posted by Detoxing

At this point it's time to accept that Tre Boston simply isn't as good as CP thinks.

The dude didn't land a contract till mid-camp last season and no one has even sniffed around him yet this year.

Did you see his stats from last season? He was better than every single safety we had on the books so what's the problem? We need vets back there, not rookies. Oh and just because other teams don't fancy him doesn't mean we should follow suit. WE HAD THE 31ST RANKED DEFENSE LAST SEASON, and you think we're In a position to be choosey? HB and Boston would take our secondary up a level imo unless you think there's a better draft prospect that we could actually get?

[DJ's left nut]

And a guy I found as part of the CP Mock who I can't quite tell if I'm convinced on or not is Jordan Brailford.

But like Tranquill, he has injury and age issues. Worse still, I have no idea if he can actually play from a 2-point stance.

I don't think I'd end up being able to take him because I think there are 3-4 teams that might like him enough to take him in the 3rd or 4th. I can't justify taking him in the 3rd and we don't have a 4th so he'd have to be a 5th for us. Is he at ALL capable of playing Sam? Man I just have no idea because he didn't do a lot out there. He seems pretty stout at the point of attack and I think he'd be solid in the run game. And he seems to be a pretty good athlete, especially at his size.

I mean it looks okay. There are measurables and motor there that all kinda look like a guy that might take to that position okay.

But that's the kind of guesswork I see having to do a lot of in this draft unless you're willing to take a pretty low ceiling player about 15-20 spots sooner than I would ideally like to do so.