Home Discord Chat
Go Back   ChiefsPlanet > Nzoner's Game Room
Register FAQDonate Members List Calendar

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-13-2013, 07:58 PM  
ShowtimeSBMVP ShowtimeSBMVP is offline
Chiefs
 
ShowtimeSBMVP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Casino cash: $3726009
Jadeveon Clowney should lawyer up, challenge nonsensical 'three-years-out' rule

He is a 6-foot-6, 256-pound athletic wonder who tracks opposing ball carriers like a laser dot and punishes them like a vindictive medicine ball.

If Jadeveon Clowney were allowed to enter April's NFL draft, rather than prepare for his junior season at South Carolina, the dripping-with-talent defensive end would likely go in the top three, and possibly the top one. Jadeveon Clowney finished the 2012 season with 13 sacks. (USA Today Sports)

Yet Clowney, because of a nine-year-old decision by the U.S. Court of Appeals for the 2nd Circuit, doesn't have the option to cash in immediately on his potential. And the risk he'll assume by playing another season for the Gamecocks has prompted some, including Charlotte Observer columnist Tom Sorensen, to suggest that Clowney sit out the 2013 season before going pro.

I have a better idea: Clowney, who turns 20 on Valentine's Day, should lawyer up and try to barge his way into the NFL this spring – the same way he blasted into the Michigan backfield during last month's Outback Bowl.

If Clowney chooses to go this route, I'll wish him well: The NFL's existing, court-sanctioned rule requiring a player to be three full seasons removed from his high school graduation before becoming draft-eligible is ridiculous, on many levels.

[Also: Steve Spurrier laughs off notion that Jadeveon Clowney should sit '13 season ]

First, it's utter nonsense. According to this rule, a wunderkind who graduates high school at 14 can apply to play professional football before he's old enough to vote, but someone whose matriculation is delayed because of, say, a severe medical condition might have to wait until he's 22.

Secondly, it's a self-serving and greedy attempt to preserve what is essentially a free farm system for the NFL – and a corrupt and hypocritical college-football machine that pays off coaches and administrators while exploiting the labor of its elite athletes.

Thirdly, and most important, it is age discrimination in its most blatant form. If Freddy Adu can be selected in the MLS SuperDraft at the age of 14, and Steffi Graf can play a professional tennis tournament when she's a few months past her 13th birthday, how is it fair that someone like Clowney has to wait until he can drink legally before plying his trade?

This is the point at which many of you start firing off emails, tweets and faxes (wait, national Signing Day is over?... never mind about that last part) reminding me that the NFL is a different animal. Yes, I am aware that pro football at its highest level is an inherently dangerous pursuit, and I know this argument for challenging draft restrictions may seem to be at cross-purposes with the many columns I have written regarding the increased need for health-and-safety protections. My first answer would be that very young men (and women) are allowed to enter similarly daunting sports like boxing, MMA, hockey and auto racing without age limits.

My second response? Did you see that hit Clowney put on Michigan running back Vincent Smith in the Outback Bowl?

It's fair to surmise that Clowney's opponents are the ones who'll need protection.

"The guy looks like a beast," one AFC general manager says of Clowney. "Shows rare close and can really bend the edge and then he hits like a truck and shows some real nasty."

[Also: Jadeveon Clowney looks to take out $5 million insurance policy for 2013 season]

Echoed an NFC GM: "Yes, he's rare. He's a mixture of Jevon Kearse and JPP (Jason Pierre-Paul). He'd go number 1 right now, no later than two. He's an absolute freak."

It seems pretty obvious that Clowney is ready for the big leagues. And if it turns out he isn't – well, can't we let the market decide? And make no mistake: physical readiness is the only issue that's even worth debating. Plenty of older players with more college experience, from Ryan Leaf to JaMarcus Russell, have proven they're not mentally or emotionally mature enough to handle life in the NFL, but that didn't preclude them from entering the draft and getting paid. Jadeveon Clowney celebrates after a win over Michigan. (Getty)

Oddly enough, I would argue that the young players who'd be most in harm's way upon entering the NFL early – running backs – are the ones getting hurt most by the current system. If you are a young, strong runner like Alabama's T.J. Yeldon or Georgia's Todd Gurley, each of whom had standout seasons as true freshmen in 2012, why should you subject yourself to approximately 500 touches apiece over the next two years for free?

Consider that if either of those backs were to enter this year's draft – another NFC GM told me Yeldon would likely be the first back off the board in that scenario – he'd not only start getting paid for all that pounding, but he'd also enhance the chances of landing an elusive second (or even third) contract because of his relative youth.

I'm sure that in retrospect Clowney's former South Carolina teammate, Marcus Lattimore, wishes he could have turned pro after the 2010 season, in which he starred as a true freshman. A torn ACL in his left knee ended his sophomore campaign, and last October he suffered a gruesome injury to his right knee, tearing multiple ligaments and suffering a dislocation that put his future prospects in jeopardy. Lattimore plans to enter the draft but will go at a much lower spot – and receive far less guaranteed money – than he would have had he been eligible two years ago.

"For a running back, especially, the wear-and-tear is so great that it's tough to justify keeping them (in college for three years)," the second NFC general manager says. "Don't get me wrong: Fans like the current system, and a lot of these kids aren't emotionally ready for pro football – and, as with the NBA, you'd have a lot of guys washing out. But it's a free country. At some point, it seems like somebody's going to challenge it and win."

[Also: Student allegedly beaten by Crimson Tide players still loves Alabama football ]

Not surprisingly, running backs have been at the forefront of previous threats to the existing system. When Chicago Bears owner George Halas signed Illinois star Red Grange to a contract in November of 1925, it helped legitimize the young NFL while enraging college football's powers that be.

The Galloping Ghost's decision to leave following his junior season led to the establishment of a rule requiring players to be four years past their high school graduation before entering the NFL. That was later amended to the current three-years-removed restriction, in 1990. Thirteen years later, another running back – former Ohio State star Maurice Clarett – sued to enter the draft and temporarily succeeded in striking down the rule.

After a phenomenal freshman season in which he led the Buckeyes to a national championship, Clarett was suspended for his entire sophomore year for taking improper benefits. Two years removed from his high school graduation, Clarett convinced a U.S. District Court judge to allow him to enter the 2004 draft, essentially rendering the existing restrictions obsolete. That decision held that eligibility rules are not immune from antitrust scrutiny under the non-statutory labor exemption.

Eight other players who'd previously been ineligible for the '04 draft, including standout USC wide receiver Mike Williams, promptly declared, only to be left out in the cold when the decision was suspended by the U.S. Court of Appeals for the 2nd Circuit.

That same three-judge panel, which included future U.S. Supreme Court Justice Sonia Sotomayor, later overturned the decision, and when the Supreme Court declined to hear the case, it essentially gave legal cover for the NFL's age-discrimination policies. Jadeveon Clowney smiles after a win over Georgia. (Getty)

I'm no lawyer, but it seems to me there are some reasonable arguments that could be made if one were to issue another challenge to the 2nd Circuit's decision. The appellate court essentially ruled that labor law trumps antitrust law in cases where the two conflict, and that both the NFL and the NFL Players Association should forgo individual antitrust protection for the sake of advancing the collective bargaining process.

However, the three-years-removed rule was not the product of collective bargaining, and draft-ineligible players (like Clarett then, or Clowney now) aren't yet members of the union. It's possible another appellate panel would ultimately view things differently, or even that the U.S. Supreme Court would take the case this time.

NFLPA executive director DeMaurice Smith was unavailable for comment Wednesday, but another high-ranking union source said the organization would welcome a legal challenge by Clowney (and/or other players) to the Clarett Decision.

[Also: NCAA Rules Committee proposes ejections for targeting players ]

I have no idea if Clowney would be interested in such a crusade, but I can see why he would be: I ran his situation by six NFL general managers on Tuesday, and the consensus was that he would "fly off the board" if eligible for the 2013 draft, with three of the GMs saying he'd likely go No. 1 overall.

As per the rookie wage scale, last year's No. 1 overall pick, Andrew Luck, received a four-year, $22.1-million contract that was fully guaranteed. That, at a minimum, seems to be what Clowney would risk by playing for the Gamecocks in 2013.

Apply this model to other careers, and imagine being a 20-year-old in that position. In that context, it's easy to see why some people believe Clowney should consider sitting out his junior season. There was even an argument Wednesday on profootballtalk.com that Clowney should intentionally fail his classes to avoid the possibility of a serious injury that could impact his future earning potential. (If that's the path he chooses, I know plenty of folks from my college days who could give him some excellent pointers.)

At the very least, the young man should protect himself: Clowney is seeking an insurance policy of up to $5 million to guard against the possibility of a catastrophic injury that could prematurely end his career in 2013. It's unclear how he'd pay the premiums, however, and there are other potential flaws with such an arrangement, such as the likelihood that a career-altering (but not career-ending) injury likely wouldn't trigger a payout.

My advice to Clowney: Find yourself a good lawyer who'd be willing to take on your case pro bono – and I suspect there are a whole lot of them who'd be interested, for the principle and/or the publicity – and see if you can blow up that nine-year-old appellate court decision the way you do opposing backfields.

If nothing else, I'd love to see Vincent Smith subpoenaed as a character witness.



http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nfl--ja...211521980.html
Posts: 23,752
ShowtimeSBMVP has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.ShowtimeSBMVP has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.ShowtimeSBMVP has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.ShowtimeSBMVP has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.ShowtimeSBMVP has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.ShowtimeSBMVP has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.ShowtimeSBMVP has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.ShowtimeSBMVP has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.ShowtimeSBMVP has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.ShowtimeSBMVP has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.ShowtimeSBMVP has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.
    Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2013, 08:12 PM   #16
Mother****erJones Mother****erJones is offline
Can't Use That Disney Ass Name
 
Mother****erJones's Avatar
 

Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Charleston, SC
Casino cash: $10015211
Clowney, Hali, Houston all rushing the passer? WOW
__________________


Quote:
Originally Posted by Hammock Parties View Post
The only people who believe Mahomes is a first rounder are desperate fans.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quesadilla Joe View Post
McCaffery could be a top 5-7 RB, top 5 PR, and the #1 slot receiver in the league day one. There isn't a GM in the league who'd rather have Tyreek Hill over Christian McCaffery.
Posts: 23,919
Mother****erJones is obviously part of the inner Circle.Mother****erJones is obviously part of the inner Circle.Mother****erJones is obviously part of the inner Circle.Mother****erJones is obviously part of the inner Circle.Mother****erJones is obviously part of the inner Circle.Mother****erJones is obviously part of the inner Circle.Mother****erJones is obviously part of the inner Circle.Mother****erJones is obviously part of the inner Circle.Mother****erJones is obviously part of the inner Circle.Mother****erJones is obviously part of the inner Circle.Mother****erJones is obviously part of the inner Circle.
    Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2013, 08:13 PM   #17
O.city O.city is offline
In Search of a Life
 
O.city's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jul 2009
Casino cash: $2824064
Being a Chiefs fan as deprived of QB play as we've been, i'd probably still take a chance on a QB, but it would be a tough decision.
Posts: 81,176
O.city is obviously part of the inner Circle.O.city is obviously part of the inner Circle.O.city is obviously part of the inner Circle.O.city is obviously part of the inner Circle.O.city is obviously part of the inner Circle.O.city is obviously part of the inner Circle.O.city is obviously part of the inner Circle.O.city is obviously part of the inner Circle.O.city is obviously part of the inner Circle.O.city is obviously part of the inner Circle.O.city is obviously part of the inner Circle.
    Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2013, 08:13 PM   #18
The Bad Guy The Bad Guy is offline
Scott Pioli
 
The Bad Guy's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: The Copacobana
Casino cash: $9373645
Quote:
Originally Posted by dtchiefs4life View Post
Clowney, Hali, Houston all rushing the passer? WOW
The nickel package would be insane.
__________________
Posts: 23,212
The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.
    Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2013, 08:13 PM   #19
Brock Brock is offline
Say hello to my little friend
 
Brock's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Larryville
Casino cash: $9598422
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Bad Guy View Post
If he's in the draft, would that change anyone's opinion it's Geno or bust?
I'm not Geno or bust, but Clowney would be my guy in this draft. Best player by far.
Posts: 47,314
Brock is obviously part of the inner Circle.Brock is obviously part of the inner Circle.Brock is obviously part of the inner Circle.Brock is obviously part of the inner Circle.Brock is obviously part of the inner Circle.Brock is obviously part of the inner Circle.Brock is obviously part of the inner Circle.Brock is obviously part of the inner Circle.Brock is obviously part of the inner Circle.Brock is obviously part of the inner Circle.Brock is obviously part of the inner Circle.
    Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2013, 08:14 PM   #20
The Bad Guy The Bad Guy is offline
Scott Pioli
 
The Bad Guy's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: The Copacobana
Casino cash: $9373645
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brock View Post
I'm not Geno or bust, but Clowney would be my guy in this draft. Best player by far.
I'm really leaning this way.

I hope he at least does challenge it to make it interesting. That pick would be a god damn mint if he was in this draft.
__________________
Posts: 23,212
The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.The Bad Guy has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.
    Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2013, 08:14 PM   #21
htismaqe htismaqe is offline
'Tis my eye!
 
htismaqe's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Chiefsplanet
Casino cash: $10269900
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Bad Guy View Post
They would absolutely fast track it the same way they did with Clarett.

It's all about the risk involved.

I'd actually be surprised if he didn't challenge it at this point. There's tons of smoke.
Clarett was a unique case in which he was literally without any other option. Clowney can got back to school and play football. He can't do it for money, no, but he's not being forced to sit at home and do nothing.

Even if they fast track it, it's going to be a HUGE distraction and one I wouldn't want anywhere near my team.
Posts: 100,022
htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.
    Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2013, 08:14 PM   #22
Hammock Parties Hammock Parties is offline
I'll be back.
 
Hammock Parties's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2002
Casino cash: $4790478
Thank god he is not coming out.

We'd have 79 percent of the fanbase screaming CLOWNEY!!!!
__________________
Chiefs game films
Posts: 277,530
Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.
    Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2013, 08:15 PM   #23
In58men In58men is offline
Baba Ganoush
 
In58men's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jan 2012
Casino cash: $2368026
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoWalrus View Post
Thank god he is not coming out.

We'd have 79 percent of the fanbase screaming CLOWNEY!!!!
How do you know he's not coming out?
Posts: 29,166
In58men is obviously part of the inner Circle.In58men is obviously part of the inner Circle.In58men is obviously part of the inner Circle.In58men is obviously part of the inner Circle.In58men is obviously part of the inner Circle.In58men is obviously part of the inner Circle.In58men is obviously part of the inner Circle.In58men is obviously part of the inner Circle.In58men is obviously part of the inner Circle.In58men is obviously part of the inner Circle.In58men is obviously part of the inner Circle.
    Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2013, 08:15 PM   #24
htismaqe htismaqe is offline
'Tis my eye!
 
htismaqe's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Chiefsplanet
Casino cash: $10269900
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Bad Guy View Post
I'm really leaning this way.

I hope he at least does challenge it to make it interesting. That pick would be a god damn mint if he was in this draft.
Jacksonville would obviously want him badly.

I'd be tempted to see what I could get for trading down to #2 and taking Geno there.
Posts: 100,022
htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.
    Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2013, 08:15 PM   #25
DaneMcCloud DaneMcCloud is offline
Supporter
 
DaneMcCloud's Avatar
 

Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Hollywood, CA
Casino cash: $10053648
Quote:
Originally Posted by KChiefer View Post
DEs win championships.
Neither will "Geno".
Posts: 88,960
DaneMcCloud is obviously part of the inner Circle.DaneMcCloud is obviously part of the inner Circle.DaneMcCloud is obviously part of the inner Circle.DaneMcCloud is obviously part of the inner Circle.DaneMcCloud is obviously part of the inner Circle.DaneMcCloud is obviously part of the inner Circle.DaneMcCloud is obviously part of the inner Circle.DaneMcCloud is obviously part of the inner Circle.DaneMcCloud is obviously part of the inner Circle.DaneMcCloud is obviously part of the inner Circle.DaneMcCloud is obviously part of the inner Circle.
    Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2013, 08:15 PM   #26
Rudy tossed tigger's salad Rudy tossed tigger's salad is offline
Better than Nelson
 
Rudy tossed tigger's salad's Avatar
 

Join Date: Mar 2003
Casino cash: $10000400
This really is a terrible article
Posts: 17,356
Rudy tossed tigger's salad would the whole thing.Rudy tossed tigger's salad would the whole thing.Rudy tossed tigger's salad would the whole thing.Rudy tossed tigger's salad would the whole thing.Rudy tossed tigger's salad would the whole thing.Rudy tossed tigger's salad would the whole thing.Rudy tossed tigger's salad would the whole thing.Rudy tossed tigger's salad would the whole thing.Rudy tossed tigger's salad would the whole thing.Rudy tossed tigger's salad would the whole thing.Rudy tossed tigger's salad would the whole thing.
    Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2013, 08:16 PM   #27
htismaqe htismaqe is offline
'Tis my eye!
 
htismaqe's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Chiefsplanet
Casino cash: $10269900
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inmem58 View Post
How do you know he's not coming out?
Right now, he can't.

And he'd be stupid to actually declare at this point. If the court doesn't rule in his favor, he'd be ineligible to return to college.
Posts: 100,022
htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.
    Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2013, 08:16 PM   #28
KChiefer KChiefer is offline
Fantastic Planeteer
 
KChiefer's Avatar
 

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Champaign, IL
Casino cash: $10006721
Quote:
Originally Posted by dtchiefs4life View Post
Clowney, Hali, Houston all rushing the passer? WOW
Nah, they'll be giving each other blows while we have no QB.
Posts: 4,943
KChiefer wants to die in a aids tree fire.KChiefer wants to die in a aids tree fire.KChiefer wants to die in a aids tree fire.KChiefer wants to die in a aids tree fire.KChiefer wants to die in a aids tree fire.KChiefer wants to die in a aids tree fire.KChiefer wants to die in a aids tree fire.KChiefer wants to die in a aids tree fire.KChiefer wants to die in a aids tree fire.KChiefer wants to die in a aids tree fire.KChiefer wants to die in a aids tree fire.
    Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2013, 08:16 PM   #29
Hammock Parties Hammock Parties is offline
I'll be back.
 
Hammock Parties's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2002
Casino cash: $4790478
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inmem58 View Post
How do you know he's not coming out?
Because I've been right about everything for over a year. Pay attention.
__________________
Chiefs game films
Posts: 277,530
Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.Hammock Parties is obviously part of the inner Circle.
    Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2013, 08:16 PM   #30
htismaqe htismaqe is offline
'Tis my eye!
 
htismaqe's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Chiefsplanet
Casino cash: $10269900
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud View Post
Neither will "Geno".
Going all in on being the "voice of reason" huh?
Posts: 100,022
htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.htismaqe is obviously part of the inner Circle.
    Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:27 PM.


This is a test for a client's site.
Fort Worth Texas Process Servers
Covering Arlington, Fort Worth, Grand Prairie and surrounding communities.
Tarrant County, Texas and Johnson County, Texas.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.