****Official 2017-2018 Missouri Tigers Basketball Thread****

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Back up in your ass with the resurrection. Follow the Cuonzo Martin era here.

Recruiting Commitments:

2017:
Michael Porter Jr., SF, *****, Gatorade National Player of the Year
CJ Roberts, PG, ****
Blake Harris, PG, ***/****
Jeremiah Tilmon, F/C, ****
Kassius Robertson, Grad Transfer
Jontay Porter (possible re-classification from Class of '18), ****

Departures: No one that matters
Returning Players: No one that matters

Overall class ranking: #6 nationally.

[duncan_idaho]

They're going to get Carte'are Gordon, too.

I was dead wrong about Martin's cache in the St. Louis area. He's just as much of a factor there as his protractors said he would be (to be fair, the same people were saying Corey Tate and Demontie Cross would allow Mizzou to dominate there, too).

Throw in the major shift in offensive philosophy, and my worries about Martin have all faded away.

The 18-19 Tigers are going to feature 3 top 40 players on the interior, all of whom were 5-stars at one point or another. Sexy.


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[Pitt Gorilla]

Originally Posted by duncan_idaho

They're going to get Carte'are Gordon, too.

I was dead wrong about Martin's cache in the St. Louis area. He's just as much of a factor there as his protractors said he would be (to be fair, the same people were saying Corey Tate and Demontie Cross would allow Mizzou to dominate there, too).

Throw in the major shift in offensive philosophy, and my worries about Martin have all faded away.

The 18-19 Tigers are going to feature 3 top 40 players on the interior, all of whom were 5-stars at one point or another. Sexy.


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I don't know. There appears to be smoke around Gordon, but I don't know that there is fire.

[duncan_idaho]

Originally Posted by Pitt Gorilla

I don't know. There appears to be smoke around Gordon, but I don't know that there is fire.

That's because the fire is in a hooded lantern.

They'll remove the hood and the fire will become fully evident.

And there will be much rejoicing.


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[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by duncan_idaho

That's because the fire is in a hooded lantern.

They'll remove the hood and the fire will become fully evident.

And there will be much rejoicing.


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And by most accounts, Martin has the '19 class in great shape as well.

The Tigers could well have 3 consecutive top 10 recruiting classes in Cuonzo's first year.

I still can't believe we hired Kermit instead of this guy. Hell, I was mad enough when he hired Haith instead of him. It took awhile, but this was the guy they've needed here for a long time.

[O.city]

I told you guys to hire him years ago


Did you listen? Oh hell no

[kcchiefsus]

Originally Posted by O.city

I told you guys to hire him years ago


Did you listen? Oh hell no

Don't blame us. That blame falls on the dumb ****s in charge and to a lesser degree all of the old timers who are more interested in hiring a nobody has been than someone who is actually good (i.e. That Mosbonian doofus).

[patteeu]

It's time to lay off Mosbonian, IMO. Anderson is long gone.

[duncan_idaho]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

And by most accounts, Martin has the '19 class in great shape as well.



The Tigers could well have 3 consecutive top 10 recruiting classes in Cuonzo's first year.



I still can't believe we hired Kermit instead of this guy. Hell, I was mad enough when he hired Haith instead of him. It took awhile, but this was the guy they've needed here for a long time.

I'll eat crow on this.

I never believed he would recruit this well in St. Louis. I've seen too many supposed fixes fail there (getting rid of Stewart, hiring Corey Tate, hiring DeMontie Cross, etc.).

He definitely would have been superior to Kim Anderson, which isn't saying a ton.

A big part of it, too, is his willingness to change his offense. That's probably the biggest transformation for me, because I think he wasted a lot of talent at Tennessee and Cal because the offensive approach was bad.




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[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by O.city

I told you guys to hire him years ago


Did you listen? Oh hell no

I started the 'Mizzou Coaching Search' thread when we hired Frank Haith. The OP contained my official endorsement of Cuonzo Martin.

Then we hired Frank Haith so I removed myself from consideration for future Coaching Search threads (that and I was taking my year long sabbatical from the board for the Anderson debacle, IIRC).

I got myself hot and bothered over the possibility of Crean but was always fine with the possibility of Cuonzo. Then he started giving interviews and actually discussed basketball substance instead of Haith's canned "we're gonna play a winning style of basketball" bullshit.

His track record of underperformance in-season makes one take pause, but there's no reason right now to be anything but excited about Cuonzo Martin and that's the first time we've been able to say that about a hire since Quinn Snyder.

[duncan_idaho]

My track record on coaching searches is:

2006: Gregg Marshall was on my list, not my top guy, but I remember him being one of them I was looking at

2011- I was 100 percent Gregg Marshall at this point.

2014 - Knew Marshall was out. My No. 1 was Chris Mack, who Alden was too chickenshit to pursue following the Painter situation.


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[duncan_idaho]

Oh, and I was all Team Crean this last time.


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[O.city]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

I started the 'Mizzou Coaching Search' thread when we hired Frank Haith. The OP contained my official endorsement of Cuonzo Martin.

Then we hired Frank Haith so I removed myself from consideration for future Coaching Search threads (that and I was taking my year long sabbatical from the board for the Anderson debacle, IIRC).

I got myself hot and bothered over the possibility of Crean but was always fine with the possibility of Cuonzo. Then he started giving interviews and actually discussed basketball substance instead of Haith's canned "we're gonna play a winning style of basketball" bullshit.

His track record of underperformance in-season makes one take pause, but there's no reason right now to be anything but excited about Cuonzo Martin and that's the first time we've been able to say that about a hire since Quinn Snyder.

Thing is, yeah he's underachieved a bit. I'm not sure he's the guy that actually wins the big thing at MU. He will get the program back to where it could be and should be with the actual basketball recruiting bed it sits in. Dunno that he can coach it over the top but I'm a fan of his.

Problem with MU fans I know and maybe this is a minority, but they don't or didn't realize how bad the program actually is/was. Respectable program was a was off from where they were

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by O.city

Thing is, yeah he's underachieved a bit. I'm not sure he's the guy that actually wins the big thing at MU. He will get the program back to where it could be and should be with the actual basketball recruiting bed it sits in. Dunno that he can coach it over the top but I'm a fan of his.

Problem with MU fans I know and maybe this is a minority, but they don't or didn't realize how bad the program actually is/was. Respectable program was a was off from where they were

Even when they got MPJ, I was trying to temper expectations. I think I was hoping for 16 wins; I just didn't see where they could find the juice to get 22+ victories.

But damn, the guy's made it hard to not get excited. MPJ is by no means an afterthought but with everything that happened in such quick succession afterwards (locking down Roberts, snagging Harris/Tilmon, even getting in the door on Knox, getting Robertson signed on) and the trickle of big news since with Jontay, Watson and the smoke behind Carter and progress on the '19 class...g'damn! You can take MJP out of the equation altogether and this has been a hell of a lot of fun (not literally; he was the anchor that made it possible - but figuratively).

My position on Cuonzo prior to the spring was that he'd do exactly what you suggested - get this team back to relevant. Not great, but 20-22 wins with regularity; an occasional Sweet 16 run and in the tournament more often than not. A nice, solid team that's at least not a national embarassment.

It may turn out that's still his ceiling but he's brought in the talent to hit that ceiling in year 1 vs. what would've been year 3-4 with even an okay spring.

It's how quickly he's yielded respectability that is so amazing. The ceiling remains an open question but man, it's going to be fun to have games that matter again. If this team can steal some ugly Ws early in the season while they're learning how to play together it could make all the difference in the world. A 10-3 non-con slate shouldn't be an unrealistic goal and if they can get there, it sets them up for a nice run at a tourney berth. But if they spin out a bit early and come into conference play at 7-6, they'll have a damn steep hill to climb and I don't see them getting there. They'll probably be in that 18 win range at that point.

[O.city]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Even when they got MPJ, I was trying to temper expectations. I think I was hoping for 16 wins; I just didn't see where they could find the juice to get 22+ victories.

But damn, the guy's made it hard to not get excited. MPJ is by no means an afterthought but with everything that happened in such quick succession afterwards (locking down Roberts, snagging Harris/Tilmon, even getting in the door on Knox, getting Robertson signed on) and the trickle of big news since with Jontay, Watson and the smoke behind Carter and progress on the '19 class...g'damn! You can take MJP out of the equation altogether and this has been a hell of a lot of fun (not literally; he was the anchor that made it possible - but figuratively).

My position on Cuonzo prior to the spring was that he'd do exactly what you suggested - get this team back to relevant. Not great, but 20-22 wins with regularity; an occasional Sweet 16 run and in the tournament more often than not. A nice, solid team that's at least not a national embarassment.

It may turn out that's still his ceiling but he's brought in the talent to hit that ceiling in year 1 vs. what would've been year 3-4 with even an okay spring.

It's how quickly he's yielded respectability that is so amazing. The ceiling remains an open question but man, it's going to be fun to have games that matter again. If this team can steal some ugly Ws early in the season while they're learning how to play together it could make all the difference in the world. A 10-3 non-con slate shouldn't be an unrealistic goal and if they can get there, it sets them up for a nice run at a tourney berth. But if they spin out a bit early and come into conference play at 7-6, they'll have a damn steep hill to climb and I don't see them getting there. They'll probably be in that 18 win range at that point.

It's always been a bit of a schock to me that the basketball program in Columbia isn't better tbh. Simply due to the recruiting base it potentially has, the state of Missouri puts out some damn good basketball players.

A relevant and good program has a good chance to land these guys. Now I don't know that they'll always be able to pull the Porters and Hansbrough type players but they should have the opportunity atleast and Cuonzo brings that

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by O.city

It's always been a bit of a schock to me that the basketball program in Columbia isn't better tbh. Simply due to the recruiting base it potentially has, the state of Missouri puts out some damn good basketball players.

A relevant and good program has a good chance to land these guys. Now I don't know that they'll always be able to pull the Porters and Hansbrough type players but they should have the opportunity atleast and Cuonzo brings that

Now you're just having the same conversation (argument) that many of us have had with the idiot blue hairs that wanted to go back to the good ol' days of Norm.

The Good Ol' Days yielded Norm Stewart pissing off the entire St. Louis area and MU trying to put together quality classes while getting no help from its most fertile local area. People kept wondering why he couldn't get to the Final 4 and the answer was almost invariably that he was a player short when the rubber hit the road.

Stewart's as much to blame as anyone for Mizzou's St. Louis problem. And as Duncan noted, there have been a couple 'saviors' since him. Here's hoping that Cuonzo can finally un**** that situation.

And when he does, it will be because the 'good ol' days' have been mercifully sent to live on a farm. The sooner we can distance this program from the Stewart era, the better.