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Old 12-10-2017, 07:24 PM  
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The attacks on Mueller push us closer to the precipice

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...010_story.html

The attacks on Mueller push us closer to the precipice

Our democratic republic is in far more danger than it was even a few weeks ago.

Until this point, there was an underlying faith in much of the political world that if Robert S. Mueller III’s investigation of Russian collusion in the election turned up unmistakably damning material about Donald Trump, Republicans in Congress would feel obligated by their commitment to the country’s well-being to accept Mueller’s findings and challenge the president.

We would often hear recollections of how Republicans during Watergate — Sen. Barry Goldwater would inevitably come up — decided that the smoking guns were too smoky and that Richard Nixon had to go. They made clear to him that he no longer had the support of his party.

Surely, said the optimists, we have not drifted so far from decency that this sort of patriotism is beyond us.

Well, it sure seems to be. It’s not surprising that Trump and those on his payroll want to protect him at all costs. But we learned last week that Republicans are deepening their complicity in derailing Mueller’s investigation and burying the facts. The more Mueller imperils Trump, the more McCarthyite the GOP becomes.

The apotheosis of Republican congressional collusion with Trump’s efforts to hang on at all costs came at a hearing of the House Judiciary Committee. One Republican after another attacked Mueller and the Federal Bureau of Investigation as if the latter should be placed on a new compendium of subversive organizations.

The occasion was testimony before the committee by Christopher A. Wray, the Trump-appointed FBI director. It was heartening to see Wray stand up for his colleagues, which made you wonder if Wray may soon go the way of his predecessor, James B. Comey.

Deserving an Academy Award for the most striking imitation of a member of the old House Un-American Activities Committee was Rep. Louie Gohmert. The hard-right Texas Republican went through a roll call of investigators, name by name, asking Wray if each had shown political bias. Wray defended every one of them he knew and wryly smiled when he was unfamiliar with one of the five names on Gohmert’s hit list.

Gohmert might as well have echoed the favored question of the congressional inquisitors of the early ’40s and ’50s: “Are they now or have they ever been . . . supporters of Hillary Clinton?” When Republicans are FBI haters who are sidetracking probes into Russian subversion, the world truly is turned upside down.

Note also the statement of Rep. Jim Jordan (R-Ohio) that if every member of Mueller’s team who was “anti-Trump” were kicked off, “I don’t know if there’d be anyone left.” The implication is that even if Mueller’s investigation produced unassailable evidence of wrongdoing by Trump, we should ignore the truth, because Mueller’s team should have been vetted to exclude anyone who had a smidgen of doubt about the president.

The rationale for this GOP assault is that Peter Strzok, an FBI agent involved in the investigation, exchanged texts critical of Trump and favorable to Clinton with an FBI lawyer. Somehow, Mueller got no props for removing Strzok from the investigation this summer.

But even if Strzok played some role in developing material that ultimately hurts Trump or proves Russian collusion, are Americans supposed to brainwash themselves? Trump’s allies want us to say: Too bad the president lied or broke the law, or that Russia tried to tilt our election. This FBI guy sending anti-Trump texts is far more important, so let’s just forget the whole thing.

Really?

Because we are inured to extreme partisanship and to the political right’s habit of rejecting inconvenient facts, we risk overlooking the profound political crisis that a Trumpified Republican Party could create. And the conflagration may come sooner rather than later, as Mueller zeroes in on Trump and his inner circle.

Only recently, it was widely assumed that if Trump fired Mueller, many Republicans would rise up to defend our institutions. Now, many in the party are laying the groundwork for justifying a coverup. This is a recipe for lawlessness.

We also assumed that Mueller’s findings would be respected because of his deserved reputation for fairness and independence. Just last May, Newt Gingrich called him a “superb choice to be special counsel” and praised his “honesty and integrity.” Now, pro-Trump politicians feel free to contradict anything they said in the past and to dismiss what they once saw as legitimate authority if those who hold it threaten their power. This is a recipe for autocracy.

Trump himself told us plainly on Friday night in Pensacola, Fla., that he will do whatever it takes to hold power, and he should be taken seriously. “There are powerful forces in Washington trying to sabotage our movement,” he declared. “These are bad people, these are very, very bad and evil people. . . . But you know what, we’re stopping them. You’re seeing that right now.”

We are far closer to the edge than we want to think.
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Old 12-11-2017, 11:00 AM   #106
IowaHawkeyeChief IowaHawkeyeChief is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Donger View Post
No.
So destroying subpoenaed evidence is OK?
Interviewing with plenty of notice and immunity of Aides is OK?
Not recording or administering Oath is OK?
Writing the conclusion before interviewing the main witness is OK?
Changing the wording "grossly negligent is OK?
Calling it a matter instead of an investigation is OK?
Meeting on the tarmac with the husband of the person being investigated is OK?
The FBI trying to hide that the Tarmac meeting took place is OK?


PLEASE Donger, you look more and more like AMDave on a daily basis...
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Old 12-11-2017, 11:02 AM   #107
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Originally Posted by patteeu View Post
There isn't a lack of evidence to the contrary.
Present it.
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Old 12-11-2017, 11:03 AM   #108
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Originally Posted by Donger View Post
Excludes them for other activities? What do you base that on?

Who are the other three?

Yes, they have been professional colleagues. What else would you expect? They both worked for the FBI at top levels over the years.
3 have been removed, I listed 3 more that should... It's not professional colleagues, they represented the Clinton foundation and the folks who set up Clinton's email server. The others have shown bias in their communication. This is classic "conflict of interest"...
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Old 12-11-2017, 11:05 AM   #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IowaHawkeyeChief View Post
So destroying subpoenaed evidence is OK?
Interviewing with plenty of notice and immunity of Aides is OK?
Not recording or administering Oath is OK?
Writing the conclusion before interviewing the main witness is OK?
Changing the wording "grossly negligent is OK?
Calling it a matter instead of an investigation is OK?
Meeting on the tarmac with the husband of the person being investigated is OK?
The FBI trying to hide that the Tarmac meeting took place is OK?


PLEASE Donger, you look more and more like AMDave on a daily basis...

Yep, all of that is ok if you're a purposeful and obtuse drama queen.
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Old 12-11-2017, 11:06 AM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IowaHawkeyeChief View Post
So destroying subpoenaed evidence is OK?
Interviewing with plenty of notice and immunity of Aides is OK?
Not recording or administering Oath is OK?
Writing the conclusion before interviewing the main witness is OK?
Changing the wording "grossly negligent is OK?
Calling it a matter instead of an investigation is OK?
Meeting on the tarmac with the husband of the person being investigated is OK?
The FBI trying to hide that the Tarmac meeting took place is OK?


PLEASE Donger, you look more and more like AMDave on a daily basis...
So destroying subpoenaed evidence is OK? Debunked. Use Google

Interviewing with plenty of notice and immunity of Aides is OK? Debunked. Use Google

Not recording or administering Oath is OK? Debunked. Use Google

Writing the conclusion before interviewing the main witness is OK? Debunked. Use Google

Changing the wording "grossly negligent is OK? Debunked. Use Google

Calling it a matter instead of an investigation is OK? Debunked. Use Google

Meeting on the tarmac with the husband of the person being investigated is OK? Debunked. Use Google

The FBI trying to hide that the Tarmac meeting took place is OK? Debunked. Use Google
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Old 12-11-2017, 11:08 AM   #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IowaHawkeyeChief View Post
So destroying subpoenaed evidence is OK?
Interviewing with plenty of notice and immunity of Aides is OK?
Not recording or administering Oath is OK?
Writing the conclusion before interviewing the main witness is OK?
Changing the wording "grossly negligent is OK?
Calling it a matter instead of an investigation is OK?
Meeting on the tarmac with the husband of the person being investigated is OK?
The FBI trying to hide that the Tarmac meeting took place is OK?


PLEASE Donger, you look more and more like AMDave on a daily basis...
So destroying subpoenaed evidence is OK? There seems to be some conflict as to whether or not that actually happened. Obviously not if it's true.

Interviewing with plenty of notice and immunity of Aides is OK? Happens all the time.

Not recording or administering Oath is OK? Doesn't really matter. Lying to the FBI is a crime regardless.

Writing the conclusion before interviewing the main witness is OK? You mean Comey's draft letter? No, I see no reason to view that that way. He was likely taking into account his team's input that they weren't finding anything prosecutable.

Changing the wording "grossly negligent is OK? No, I think that should be investigated.

Calling it a matter instead of an investigation is OK? Meh. "Just call it a matter," Comey said he was told by Lynch.

When asked why he didn't push back against Lynch's request, Comey said it was because he decided, "This isn't a hill worth dying on, and so I just said, ‘Okay.' The press is going to completely ignore it – and that's what happened."

Meeting on the tarmac with the husband of the person being investigated is OK? No, it wasn't. What does that have to do with the FBI? That was Bubba and Lynch. Fine with me if it's investigated.

The FBI trying to hide that the Tarmac meeting took place is OK? I don't know what you're referring to here.
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Old 12-11-2017, 11:09 AM   #112
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Originally Posted by IowaHawkeyeChief View Post
3 have been removed, I listed 3 more that should... It's not professional colleagues, they represented the Clinton foundation and the folks who set up Clinton's email server. The others have shown bias in their communication. This is classic "conflict of interest"...
I must have missed where you listed the other three. Who are they?
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Old 12-11-2017, 11:09 AM   #113
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Really do not think Comey and Mueller are all that partisan. Personally, I think they both are all about their power and powerful connections and how to enhance that power.

Comey let Hillary off thinking she was going to be President and O pretty much told the press this is how he wanted the investigation to go down. Comey really was a good soldier with Trump, ie admitting Trump was not under investigation etc, not even telling Trump he was out of line. All he did was make some Memo's he kept to himself to protect his own power and job. Once Trump kicked him to the curb, he then makes sure there is a special prosecutor and some how his good buddy is that prosecutor.
Yea Partisan isn't the right word. Its more of political motivation and power. Either way Comey is agenda driven not neutral and that is pretty obvious.

Good post.
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Old 12-11-2017, 11:09 AM   #114
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Originally Posted by Pennywise View Post
Yep, all of that is ok if you're a purposeful and obtuse drama queen.
Yes, I'm full of drama...

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Old 12-11-2017, 11:10 AM   #115
IowaHawkeyeChief IowaHawkeyeChief is offline
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Originally Posted by Donger View Post
Present it.
The minimum should have been the statue that doesn't require intent and just gross negligence. They changed the wording from Grossly Negligent to extremely careless in their official statement. Comey testified before congress that Hillary was untruthful in her answers on classified documents. They destroyed documents.... This is true obstruction of justice...
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Old 12-11-2017, 11:13 AM   #116
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Originally Posted by IowaHawkeyeChief View Post
The minimum should have been the statue that doesn't require intent and just gross negligence. They changed the wording from Grossly Negligent to extremely careless in their official statement. Comey testified before congress that Hillary was untruthful in her answers on classified documents. They destroyed documents.... This is true obstruction of justice...
And I think that Comey should be asked under oath why he apparently agreed to said change of language.
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Old 12-11-2017, 11:16 AM   #117
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Originally Posted by Donger View Post
And I think that Comey should be asked under oath why he apparently agreed to said change of language.
Because Obama directed them that they were not to charge Hillary. Its not even a point of question Donger.

They were never going to let the DNC Presidential candidate be charged with anything during the election especially when they expected she would win.
Surely you understand this.

Here is a great opinion piece on the subject.

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner...bamas-decision
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Old 12-11-2017, 11:20 AM   #118
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Originally Posted by Marcellus View Post
Because Obama directed them that they were not to charge Hillary. Its not even a point of question Donger.

They were never going to let the DNC Presidential candidate be charged with anything during the election especially when they expected she would win.
Surely you understand this.

Here is a great opinion piece on the subject.

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner...bamas-decision
Let me get this straight. You state that Obama directed FBI not to recommend charges. That's a statement of fact.

You then present an opinion piece on the matter to support your "fact."

Do you see the issue here?
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Old 12-11-2017, 11:21 AM   #119
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Originally Posted by patteeu View Post
There isn't a lack of evidence to the contrary.
Paid Russian troll says what?
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Old 12-11-2017, 11:34 AM   #120
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Originally Posted by Donger View Post
Let me get this straight. You state that Obama directed FBI not to recommend charges. That's a statement of fact.

You then present an opinion piece on the matter to support your "fact."

Do you see the issue here?
It was a fact that Obama said publicly how he saw Clinton's use of the server not being illegal. Shortly thereafter and before the investigation is complete then Comey drafts a letter using the same reasoning. That is a fact, what inferences you argue from those facts are opinions.
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