****The official NEW new conference realignment thread.****

[Saul Good]

the second thread has been pronounced dead.

[Saul Good]

Originally Posted by Prison Bitch

Having trouble following you. Computer rankings are always welcome by me because they're factual and a fool would argue against them. I'm glad Saul is finally seeing the benefit of discussing the computers rather than crazy rants. I don't use them selectively at all, and even said Mizzou left the poverty ranks this year. But let's see how it plays out before we declare them some type of national power.

When did I assign any value to computer rankings? Was it back when Mizzou had all those consecutive losing seasons that never happened?

[Prison Bitch]

Missouri didn't have a string of losing seasons in the 80s and 90s? I thought they did.

[Saul Good]

New bizarre Prison Bitch talking point alert: Saint Louis has more Mizzou alums than Kansas City.

What that has to do with anything...is...absolutely nothing

[Prison Bitch]

Originally Posted by Saul Good

Saint Louis has more Mizzou slums

[Saul Good]

Originally Posted by Prison Bitch

Okay, that was funny...also true.

[warpaint*]

Originally Posted by Prison Bitch

The BIG is easily the best conference to me overall with their collection of excellent schools. Long term they're near the top in both major sports and academically they're quite prestigious which is why Jay Nixon made the statement he did about joining them.

I normally associated Mizzou with Kansas, Iowa and Illinois rather than Kentucky, Ole Miss and Arkansas. But I'm not an alum so that may not be the perception of folks around the state particularly in St Louis where most of them are.

Iowa? Hardly.

I grew up a Big 8 kid like all Mizzou fans/alums my age, (37). I "associate" us w/ the old Big 8 & Tx schools as the Big 12 to me was just an extension of the Big 8. While I am still a fan of the Big 12 3 of the original 8 and 4 of 12 are gone, it's not exactly the same league anymore. On top of that Colorado is not the Colorado of my youth.

The Big Ten is a snooze fest and dying product (football) w/ no teams in anchor states for talent (CA/TX/Fla). Population shifts and demographics are killing it slowly.

We've played Illinois OOC all my life. Continuing to do that isn't a change from the norm.

The overall culture of the state is midwestern and southern. Some parts more than the other depending on where you are. MU fits in better w/ these SEC states than some of these upper midwest ones. Is it a perfect fit? No, the Big 12 was but that didn't appear to be feasible long term at the time a golden parachute in the form of the SEC opportunity presented itself. We fit in as well there as the Big Ten.

[Saul Good]

Originally Posted by warpaint*

Iowa? Hardly.

I grew up a Big 8 kid like all Mizzou fans/alums my age, (37). I "associate" us w/ the old Big 8 & Tx schools as the Big 12 to me was just an extension of the Big 8. While I am still a fan of the Big 12 3 of the original 8 and 4 of 12 are gone, it's not exactly the same league anymore. On top of that Colorado is not the Colorado of my youth.

The Big Ten is a snooze fest and dying product (football) w/ no teams in anchor states for talent (CA/TX/Fla). Population shifts and demographics are killing it slowly.

We've played Illinois OOC all my life. Continuing to do that isn't a change from the norm.

The overall culture of the state is midwestern and southern. Some parts more than the other depending on where you are. MU fits in better w/ these SEC states than some of these upper midwest ones. Is it a perfect fit? No, the Big 12 was but that didn't appear to be feasible long term at the time a golden parachute in the form of the SEC opportunity presented itself. We fit in as well there as the Big Ten.

Pretty much this.

Missouri is similar in a lot of respects to Kansas, Iowa, and Illinois. (I'm not really sure what Illinois has to do with this discussion, though.) The Big 8 was a great fit for Missouri with teams from Iowa, Kansas, Nebraska, Oklahoma, and Colorado. Those days are long gone, though.

Colorado and Nebraska are no longer in the conference. Half of the conference is now from Texas or West Virginia. The hapless leadership of Don Bebee drove 40% of the members away...to three different conferences. It's not like one conference made one school an offer it couldn't refuse. This is evidence of systemic problems in the league despite the way those left behind have tried to spin it.

If you meet an asshole in the morning, you met an asshole. If you meet assholes all day...you're the asshole. The Big 12 has met nothing but assholes for years.

Today, it's a dying conference with no identity, but it doesn't even seem to realize it. Of the major conferences, it's got the worst football, mediocre at best basketball, the worst academics, the worst geographic layout, and the most unbalanced power structure.

To their credit, they have taken steps to remedy the last item on that list, but they did so only after 4 members left taking three states with them. To make things worse, the two additions they made were done out of desperation rather than foresight. Predictably, they have been unmitigated disasters. These schools have brought terrible football, terrible basketball, terrible academics, terrible fan support, and they have made a mockery of the conference in terms of having a shared culture or cohesive footprint...and it's STILL the smallest in terms of member institutions and overall enrollment. For crying out loud...when you have four schools out of ten in Texas alone, you wouldn't think that one of the schools would have to be 900 miles away from it's closest compatriot...but you'd be wrong.

A case can be made for the SEC, PAC, or B1G being the strongest major conference overall...but the Big 12 is last with a bullet.

[Saul Good]

Just trying to get his hands around it, Bob? Way to choose your words...

http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports...-two-felonies/

[Bambi]

Originally Posted by Saul Good

Pretty much this.

Missouri is similar in a lot of respects to Kansas, Iowa, and Illinois. (I'm not really sure what Illinois has to do with this discussion, though.) The Big 8 was a great fit for Missouri with teams from Iowa, Kansas, Nebraska, Oklahoma, and Colorado. Those days are long gone, though.

Colorado and Nebraska are no longer in the conference. Half of the conference is now from Texas or West Virginia. The hapless leadership of Don Bebee drove 40% of the members away...to three different conferences. It's not like one conference made one school an offer it couldn't refuse. This is evidence of systemic problems in the league despite the way those left behind have tried to spin it.

If you meet an asshole in the morning, you met an asshole. If you meet assholes all day...you're the asshole. The Big 12 has met nothing but assholes for years.

Today, it's a dying conference with no identity, but it doesn't even seem to realize it. Of the major conferences, it's got the worst football, mediocre at best basketball, the worst academics, the worst geographic layout, and the most unbalanced power structure.

To their credit, they have taken steps to remedy the last item on that list, but they did so only after 4 members left taking three states with them. To make things worse, the two additions they made were done out of desperation rather than foresight. Predictably, they have been unmitigated disasters. These schools have brought terrible football, terrible basketball, terrible academics, terrible fan support, and they have made a mockery of the conference in terms of having a shared culture or cohesive footprint...and it's STILL the smallest in terms of member institutions and overall enrollment. For crying out loud...when you have four schools out of ten in Texas alone, you wouldn't think that one of the schools would have to be 900 miles away from it's closest compatriot...but you'd be wrong.

A case can be made for the SEC, PAC, or B1G being the strongest major conference overall...but the Big 12 is last with a bullet.

Where do you keep your trophies for best conference? Did you guys construct a building?

[Bambi]

The Playoff Committee has been selected:

Chair: Jeff Long

Director of athletics at the University of Arkansas, Long was a two-sport athlete at Ohio Wesleyan in the late 1970s and early 1980s. A 54-year-old native of Kettering, Ohio, Long has been athletics director at Pittsburgh and Eastern Kentucky and served in senior positions at Oklahoma, Virginia Tech and Michigan.

Barry Alvarez

Alvarez, 66, is a Pennsylvania native, Nebraska graduate and Wisconsin football coach-turned-athletics director. From 1990 to 2006 he led Wisconsin to 11 bowls (including three Rose Bowl victories) after the school had only reached six in its previous football history. He is Wisconsin's all-time winningest coach.

Lt. Gen. Michael Gould

Gould is the recently retired Superintendent of the United States Air Force Academy. He is a 1976 academy graduate and former Falcons football player as well as a command pilot with more than 3,100 flight hours. He is 60.

Pat Haden

Director of athletics at USC, Haden is a former Rhodes Scholar and quarterback for the Trojans and Los Angeles Rams. A California native, the 60-year-old Haden has been a partner in a private equity firm, a practicing attorney and the color commentator for Notre Dame football.

Tom Jernstedt

Jernstedt spent 38 years with the NCAA beginning in 1972, rising to the title of Executive Vice President and most notably overseeing the men's basketball Final Four and working with the men's basketball tournament selection committee. An Oregon native and former University of Oregon athlete, the 68-year-old Jernstedt is a past president of USA Basketball and member of the College Basketball Hall of Fame.

Oliver Luck

Director of athletics at West Virginia, Luck led the Mountaineers into the Big 12 Conference. Luck, 53, is a Cleveland native and former Rhodes Scholar finalist who played quarterback for West Virginia and the Houston Oilers. He formerly was vice president of business development for the NFL, president of NFL Europe, and the first president of the Houston Dynamo of MLS.

Archie Manning

From Drew, Miss., and a longtime New Orleans resident, Archie Manning is a University of Mississippi legend who played quarterback in the NFL from 1971-84. A frequent football commentator, the 64-year-old also runs the annual Manning Passing Academy with his sons.

Tom Osborne

Osborne, from Hastings, Neb., led the University of Nebraska football team to national championships in 1994, 1995 and 1997 (a shared title) and 13 conference championships. After retiring as the Cornhuskers' coach, he served six years in the U.S. House of Representatives and also was Nebraska's athletics director. Osborne is 76.

Dan Radakovich

Director of athletics at Clemson, Radakovich is one of 10 athletic directors appointed to lead the NCAA's restructuring efforts. The 54-year-old Aliquippa, Pa., native previously was director of athletics at Georgia Tech and American University.

Condoleezza Rice

Rice, 58, served as the United States' National Security Advisor from 2001-05 and Secretary of State from 2005-09. A native of Birmingham, Ala., she holds degrees from the University of Denver and Notre Dame, and is a professor of political science at Stanford, where she has been on faculty at Stanford since 1981.

Mike Tranghese

Tranghese was commissioner of the Big East Conference for 19 years until his retirement in June, 2008. Tranghese, 69, joined the league at its inception in 1979 and guided it through the addition of football and later expansion and contraction.

Steve Wieberg

A 59-year-old Missouri resident, Wieberg was a college sports reporter and original member of the USA TODAY staff from 1982 to 2012.

Tyrone Willingham

Willingham, 59, is a former coach at Stanford, Notre Dame and the University of Washington. A Michigan State grad, his coaching career spanned 32 seasons, and now he works as a volunteer assistant for the Stanford women's golf team.

[Prison Bitch]

Originally Posted by Saul Good

Half of the conference is now from Texas or West Virginia.

Texas is a huge state with a big growth rate in the Sun Belt. That's the argument I've heard a lot of MU fans say about going to the SEC. I don't see the difference.

Predictably, they have been unmitigated disasters. These schools have brought terrible football, terrible basketball, terrible academics, terrible fan support,.

The "bad football" argument has already been defeated by pulling up the Sagarin data showing there's zero difference in the cumulative ranking of all teams. Now you can argue about image, but quality of football is a myth.


I'm not certain how you argue "academics" here and as far as "fan support", only Nebraska football & ATM football were consistent big draws.

[mnchiefsguy]

Interesting article on the positive benefits for the SEC of adding Mizzou and A & M. I doubt TCU and WVA would have provided the same benefit:


http://espn.go.com/college-football/...sec%19s-muscle

[Saul Good]

Originally Posted by Prison Bitch

Texas is a huge state with a big growth rate in the Sun Belt. That's the argument I've heard a lot of MU fans say about going to the SEC. I don't see the difference.

If you were capable of following a linear conversation, you would know that the Texas comment was in response to Missouri being a cultural fit with Iowa, Kansas, and (for some odd reason) Illinois. Texas culture and West Virgina culture are not similar to Missouri...and those two states make up half of the conference. As such, the cultural fit argument doesn't hold much weight.

Originally Posted by Prison Bitch

The "bad football" argument has already been defeated by pulling up the Sagarin data showing there's zero difference in the cumulative ranking of all teams. Now you can argue about image, but quality of football is a myth.


I'm not certain how you argue "academics" here and as far as "fan support", only Nebraska football & ATM football were consistent big draws.

I know you worship Sagarin, but calling TCU and West Virginia quality programs on par with what you lost simply doesn't make it so. Massey has Mizzou #1 and TCU #49. West Virginia is #51.

The Big 12 has the fewest AAU members of any major conference, and all four schools that left are in the AAU.

Colorado has poor attendance, but Mizzou, Nebraska, and aTm have all been consistently top 30 nationally. Last year, Nebraska would have been second in attendance in the Big 12...so would aTm. Both would have trailed Texas. Mizzou would have been third behind Oklahoma.

Mizzou averaged 21,000 more fans per game than TCU and 12,000 more than West Virginia.

Don't fight this battle. You're getting your ass kicked.

[TribalElder]

Dippin dots are the future tho bro

[Prison Bitch]

Originally Posted by mnchiefsguy

Interesting article on the positive benefits for the SEC of adding Mizzou and A & M. I doubt TCU and WVA would have provided the same benefit:


http://espn.go.com/college-football/...sec%19s-muscle

That's shocking, I would've thought they'd all bag on them. It's funny though, last year all we heard was "Give Mizzou time, lets judge them 10 years in". Now they're declaring them a success after two SEC games. Hilarious.