Let's talk about "true fans"

[DaFace]

Marcellus's thread was clearly a lot of attention whoring, but when it comes down to it, he has a point. The word "true fan" has become a catch-all for anyone who doesn't agree with a person on here about XXX player or XXX move that the Chiefs have made.

The issue I have with it is that it's increasingly become a straw man insult that doesn't even make sense. Discussion around here lately reminds me of discussions in D.C. where every issue has to be black and white and anyone who doesn't agree with you is an idiot. The reality is that there are opinions all over the spectrum and that nothing is ever black and white. I'd think there are at least five different categories of Chiefs fans these days:

1 - True "homers" who will cheer for the team and applaud every move they make unconditionally. These types almost don't even exist on ChiefsPlanet (though people like to act like they do). These are only a small portion of the Chiefs fanbase, and they look like this.

2 - Optimists who will always cheer for the Chiefs, but have a sense of realism about it. They probably cheered Cassel for the first few years, but reluctantly joined the SOC bandwagon last year when it was clear that there was just no hope in saving the team under Cassel.

3 - Fans who try to keep a balanced approach. They don't get too excited about drafting a RT at #1 or trading for Alex Smith, but they believe that it's likely the team will at least be improved this year if not dramatically so. Their approach is a "wait and see" reaction, though they'll be quick to criticize if things don't work out.

4 - Pessimists who are skeptical that the Chiefs are going to be competitive any time soon, but who do try and give the team some benefit of the doubt under the new leadership. They're probably not happy about Alex Smith being our QB, but are grudgingly willing to see what he can do.

5 - Total naysayers who have had it with the team for the past 40 years and will refuse to be optimistic until the Chiefs find some real success (playoff wins at a minimum, and Super Bowl contention ideally). They believe that the front office should be constantly scrutinized given that their predecessors were given a long leash and screwed it all up.

Anyway, I thought it would be interesting to see where people would put themselves on the spectrum. It seems like most threads these days are battles between 5's and 1's, but I'd bet that those types are actually pretty rare around here. My dream would be that we can one day have discussions that are dominated by 2's, 3's, and 4's, but who knows if that can ever happen until the Chiefs start showing success.

Discus.

[Pasta Little Brioni]

Team had no confidence in the Pioli, Herm eras.

[Rausch]

I'm tired of being an average Joe that points out clearly stupid moves but we keep making these stupid moves.

"You're not an NFL GM or HC. You think you know better?"

Yes.

Flat out, bold as can be, YES. YES.

There are moves a team can make that are so ****ing stupid the guy selling free programs outside the stadium could catch them.

We make them every year.

Every year we're that team that gets drunk off the one day performance at the combine and drafts a guy WAAAAAAAAAAY above his worth.

Poe. Jackson. Baldwin.

It's knowing exactly what they're going to do (overvalue a player of need,) they do it, and it so sickening and obvious you want to punch a Nun.

I wouldn't claim to know more than the average NFL scout - what I'm saying is our 1st round draft picks look worse than if they would have followed the opinions of the average fan...

[splatbass]

Originally Posted by Pablo

If you haven't given up hope after last season and the off-season "moves" the Chiefs made; then you likely never will.

Hope is a dangerous thing, folks.

Fear of hope is a sad and pathetic thing, folks.

[stevieray]

Originally Posted by Alex Smith HATER

The highest concentration of Lil Chiefys in one room to date:

that crowd was cued to cheer for the camera

[BigMeatballDave]

Originally Posted by stevieray

that crowd was cued to cheer for the camera

This stuff is way over his head.

[BigMeatballDave]

Hope is a dangerous thing?

[Hammock Parties]

Originally Posted by TrueFanDave

Hope is a dangerous thing?

You haven't been beaten with the fail stick enough to learn your lesson, huh?

[BigCatDaddy]

Originally Posted by Marcellus

You can feel all hopless and lost, its your right.

I do find it hilarious that some fans would have "hope" if we would have used 1.1 on a 2nd round caliber QB.

There wasn't a franchise caliber QB in this draft and I 100% believe if there was Dorsey and Reid would have been all over it.

You can hold your breath and stomp your feet and show disgust all day long, it doesn't change the fact it was a shit QB class.

It's early, but base on early reports would you rather have Geno or Fisher in camp with the Chiefs?

[Rausch]

Originally Posted by BigCatDaddy

It's early, but base on early reports would you rather have Geno or Fisher in camp with the Chiefs?

Milliner or Warmack...

[BigCatDaddy]

Originally Posted by Rausch

Milliner or Warmack...

I was on the Austin bandwagon(If we weren't going with a QB). I hadn't followed how he has looked in camp.

But to answer the question I would rather have a guy that looks like he is going to get to be an opening day starter than a guy that is struggling at RT. But it's early.

[Sorter]

Originally Posted by Rausch

Milliner or Warmack...

DeCastro is the guard of the century and don't you forget it.

[el borracho]

Originally Posted by Marcellus

You can feel all hopless and lost, its your right.

I do find it hilarious that some fans would have "hope" if we would have used 1.1 on a 2nd round caliber QB.

There wasn't a franchise caliber QB in this draft and I 100% believe if there was Dorsey and Reid would have been all over it.

You can hold your breath and stomp your feet and show disgust all day long, it doesn't change the fact it was a shit QB class.

It doesn't have to be an either/or situation. No franchise caliber QB in this class still doesn't mandate that you trade valuable picks for a bottom third QB. There are other options.

[Bearcat]

Originally Posted by Pablo

If you haven't given up hope after last season and the off-season "moves" the Chiefs made; then you likely never will.

Hope is a dangerous thing, folks.

I saw a news segment last night about the record crowds at training camp and how Chiefs/Cowboys tickets are averaging ~$200 right now (granted, Cowboys fans are probably part of that, it's amusing since both fanbases haven't had many reasons to pay that much for tickets since the mid-90s)....

Originally Posted by Pablo

You watched your team play a historically awful season; then trade for a lame stopgap QB and draft a RT No. 1 overall.

If that gets you hard, then so be it.

...it's crazy how they can fail in exactly the same way over and over and over, but simply trying to start over every few years creates enough buzz to keep fans coming back time and time again.

Originally Posted by Marcellus

You can feel all hopless and lost, its your right.

I do find it hilarious that some fans would have "hope" if we would have used 1.1 on a 2nd round caliber QB.

There wasn't a franchise caliber QB in this draft and I 100% believe if there was Dorsey and Reid would have been all over it.

You can hold your breath and stomp your feet and show disgust all day long, it doesn't change the fact it was a shit QB class.

Would you have been angry if the Chiefs had 1.1 and used it to draft Aaron Rodgers? My opinion is that maybe this was the one draft where we can be 100% certain there was no QB worth taking at #1, but it doesn't excuse the fact that they once again spent a draft pick on another team's backup or didn't take a chance in the 3rd.

Someone posted the stat during the draft.... the Packers have drafted something like 13 QBs in the first 3 rounds since 1992, and they had Favre for 15 of those years. The Chiefs have drafted one, I think? One franchise clearly gets it, while the other does not.

So, maybe Dorsey knew this wasn't the year, and previous regime's failures aren't his fault, but you can't keep feeding me the same shit over and over and over and expect me to think it's going to be different the 5th or 6th or 7th time around. Again, that's not their fault, and maybe they really do see something in Alex Smith or they're already looking at someone for next year, etc; but the same things could be said about previous regimes, too. 'Hopeless' is a strong word... I'm much more apathetic than anything.

[Saccopoo]

Originally Posted by Rausch

I'm tired of being an average Joe that points out clearly stupid moves but we keep making these stupid moves.

"You're not an NFL GM or HC. You think you know better?"

Yes.

Flat out, bold as can be, YES. YES.

There are moves a team can make that are so ****ing stupid the guy selling free programs outside the stadium could catch them.

We make them every year.

Every year we're that team that gets drunk off the one day performance at the combine and drafts a guy WAAAAAAAAAAY above his worth.

Poe. Jackson. Baldwin.

It's knowing exactly what they're going to do (overvalue a player of need,) they do it, and it so sickening and obvious you want to punch a Nun.

I wouldn't claim to know more than the average NFL scout - what I'm saying is our 1st round draft picks look worse than if they would have followed the opinions of the average fan...

You'd like to think that Poe, Jackson and Baldwin were horrible overdrafts, but, in all honesty, they weren't. All three players were pretty well respected leading up to the draft and while they may have went from a few to ten spots earlier than a lot of people though, those picks weren't complete left field, head scratchers.

They were absolutely viable picks, especially considering the Chiefs roster at the time.

- Jackson was absolutely necessary as we were switching to a 34 defense and there wasn't a single legitimate 34 end on the roster at the time. His height, weight and length are as damn near prototype for the five tech position as you can find. The problem that Jackson has had is that he isn't Richard Seymour, which most people around here think he should be - which isn't going to be the case regardless of where he was picked in the draft.

- When we selected Baldwin, our receiving corps was virtually nil. There was Bowe and that was literally about it. Nada. Zilch. And Baldwin, while not the most polished route runner and somewhat lazy in college, had a lot of really incredible circus catch tape and his measurables were simply off the charts. Maybe the best I've ever seen from a wide receiver prospect:

6'4"
230 lbs.
40: 4.5 seconds
Bench: 20 reps
Vertical: 42"
Broad: 129"

Those are insanity sauce level numbers, and to go along with his strong hands and run after the catch ability, he's an easy pick for the Chiefs at that time.

Poe, like Baldwin, was a combine freak whose numbers were absolutely astounding for a man of his size. Add to it that the only legitimate nose tackle on the roster was Jerrell Powe, who was just coming off an non-existent off-season rookie season where he didn't see any significant playing time behind Kelly Gregg. And as the NT in a 34 is the absolute anchor for that entire defense, I'm sure that Crennel and Pioli had visions of Vince Wilfork dancing in their heads when they saw Dontari Poe. Another viable pick for the team considering their roster and scheme.

The real question about these three guys is that the only coach that they've known is Crennel, who, at this point, should be considered one of, if not the worst NFL head coach of the 21st century. His record speaks for itself. (Yes, Jackson had Haley as his head coach initially, but Crennel was his defensive coordinator.)

[Saccopoo]

Originally Posted by Bearcat

So, maybe Dorsey knew this wasn't the year, and previous regime's failures aren't his fault, but you can't keep feeding me the same shit over and over and over and expect me to think it's going to be different the 5th or 6th or 7th time around. Again, that's not their fault, and maybe they really do see something in Alex Smith or they're already looking at someone for next year, etc; but the same things could be said about previous regimes, too. 'Hopeless' is a strong word... I'm much more apathetic than anything.

I'm pretty sure that Reid sees Alex Smith as his prototype for running the Edwards West Coast system. Very smart, very accurate in the intermediary range, doesn't put the ball into the defenses hands and is athletic enough to keep the defenses honest if he needs to pull the ball down and take off.

This may sound a bit crazy, but I firmly believe that Alex Smith is a better fit/better QB for running Andy's offense than Donovan McNabb and I think that's what Reid believes as well. I think he believes that with Smith and the roster as it stands can win and win a lot right now.

I think that if this team buys into what Reid wants them to do and Sutton can get even 20% more out of the defense that they gave last season under Crennel, this team wins the AFC West and a first round playoff game this season with a shot at more.

Like I said earlier 11-5, AFC West Champs and they lose to the Texans in the AFC Championship game in 2013.