HEY SORTER!! (and SULLY)

[Dinny Bossa Nova]

Is there any way you guys can learn us some football?

I respect, admire and am totally green with envy y'all's knowledge of football defenses and offenses and the structuring of the plays and such.

My personal playing experience pinnacle is the sandlot with neighborhood kids where the greatest play ever called was "EVERYBODY GO OUT FOR A PASS!!!!"

I am the epitome of the armchair fan watching a game that has no idea what he is looking at. But I still dig the hell out of it.

I'm too old and creepy to attend a football for girls class, so is there anywhere to get started like a football for dummies path to follow?

The Jets playbook is kind of useless to me at this point. I'm looking for the cue-cards being held a little lower.

You guys could probably organize some seminars and get tons of us mopes here to sign up. I'd like to sit in the front row.

Enlighten us, wise ones, please.

Dinny

[Sorter]

Originally Posted by Sully

Sorter, you're more of a back 7 guy than I (or, that's my impression).

What do you think "All Zones are "no run" coverages unless tagged" means? No running with the motion?

Thats how I took it.

[Dinny Bossa Nova]

"If you'll notice, it states that it's a either Cover 3 (Trey) and Cover 6 (Pack) depending on the offensive alignment. The front can also change by alignment."

This image is kind of dark, so it's hard to see very well. The acronyms and abbreviations in the coaching points are over my head. To be perfectly honest, just about everything in the coaching points is over my head.

1. What is "REDUCE=AUTOMATIC FRONT"?

2. What is YOFF?

3. What is "REDUCE vs. 2 back set (unless YOFF)"?

4. What is "UNDER vs. U/H removed OPEN side (or YOFF)"?

5. What is "OVER ED vs. U/H removed CLOSED side"?

6. What is "RUSH vs. EMPTY"?

7 What is "OPEN $ can check "SKY" vs. 2 BACK SET"?

8. What is "PACK checks "BOX" vs. BUNCH"?

9. What is "STUNTS: TILT"?

10. What is "can also play as REDUCE 23 SKY"?

Dinny

[Dinny Bossa Nova]

Originally Posted by Sully

The symbols are just personal preference. X and Y are the two eligible receivers on the LoS, and Z is always the first slot. (Y is typically the TE, if there is one). As for the OL, you just kinda know who they are based on where they are. Many times the center's symbol is square instead of circle, as well, while the rest are round. Same thing for the Q. You just kinda know who the Q is based on alignment, although I've seen some coaches actually put the little squiggle to make his oval and actual "Q."
The shading in the circles shows where the DL alignment is.

Understand that the playbook pictures are install pieces. So while it may say "primarily on 1st and 2nd down," that's just for the purpose of the players learning their own call tendencies. Once the first game comes, game planning throws all that out the window, as does personnel groupings and tendencies. 11 personnel (1 RB, 1 TE) might mean one thing for one opponent, and something completely different for another. But during install, you are just, typically, installing vs pro personnel (2 RB, 1 TE), and a few common formations, since you aren't planning for any opponent.

This explains the OL symbols perfectly. I figured you could tell from their place on the page you can spot the guard, etc. The shading in the oval was what was throwing me. I can see now it directs the alignment.

I assumed, as well, that these are just base alignments, and there are a mind boggling number of variations depending on the team or even different personnel groupings within a team.

Groovy stuff. Thanks, Sully.

Dinny

[Sully]

The computer I'm on isn't showing those images, so I can't see specifically.

YOFF would mean the TE is off the LoS.

This defense is, essentially, what I would call a 20 defense (in my terminology, this is the fisrt number is the technique to the strong side, the last number to the weak side, so 20 would mean a 2 and a 0 shade).

The U/H refers to the fullback/H-Back (or any player who is "in" for that guy).
Here's where it might get a little involved
"Under vs U/H removed to open side (or YOFF)"
-This means if the fullback/H-back moves to a slot position away from the TE, the defense goes from a 20, to a 03, which is called "under" (essentially the defense Pendergast ran when he was our DC). If you look at the "Twin" slide, that shows the change in DL alignment.

Ed is the DE to the strong side. Rush is Hali, and S is the OLB opposite the Ed. What the defense does is, if they go to an under front, make sure to put the Ed over the TE (in a 6 tech) so that he isn't hooked (blocked down), and so the SLB can have inside leverage on the #2 receiver.

[Sully]

I can't tell what "Rush" vs empty means, other than maybe telling the Rush backer he's on an automatic go in an empty set.

[Sully]

"Pack checks 'box' to Bunch"

Bunch is when three receivers all line up right near each other.
You know when this happens, one guy is going to run some sort of in route, one guy is going to run some sort of out route, and one guy will run something in the middle. So it's just a zone check that, tells the CB he keeps everything in front of him, and looks for the deep runner, the S backer gets to the flat, and looks for the first route coming outside, and the Safety to that side gets the deepest in cutter. The Mike is probably walling (looking for any crosser).

[Sully]

Originally Posted by Sully

I can't tell what "Rush" vs empty means, other than maybe telling the Rush backer he's on an automatic go in an empty set.

I'm still struggling with this, because the Rush backer is going vs every front, so I don't know what the check rush or check Ed means.

Oh, I think it widens his alignment, the more I look at it.

[Sorter]

Originally Posted by Sully

I'm still struggling with this, because the Rush backer is going vs every front, so I don't know what the check rush or check Ed means.

Oh, I think it widens his alignment, the more I look at it.

Check rush means when they get empty, they align with 2 3-techs, 9 closed, 7 open (assume Y on). Sam is walked out on #2 closed and $ is walked out on #2 open. Coverage changed to Trey.


I'll post the screencaps from the playbook later tonight. For all the hate the Ryan brothers get, they make a very friendly install.

[Sully]

I wasn't even looking at the interior guys
Thanks

[Dinny Bossa Nova]

Back to this one. Concerning the defense.

C = Cornerback?
$ = Safety? If so, is there a way to tell strong or free? Or does not apply?
N = Nose Tackle?
S = ?
E = ?
T = ?
M = ?
W = ?
R = ?

Could you imagine having to "dummy down" a playbook for me? Probably would have to come up with a more accurate term than dummy.

Dinny

[Sorter]

Originally Posted by Dinny Blues

Back to this one. Concerning the defense.

C = Cornerback
$ = Safety. No free or strong.
N = Nose Tackle
S = Sam
E = End
T = Tackle
M = Mike
W = Will
R = Rush
N= Nickel player
D=Dime player
Could you imagine having to "dummy down" a playbook for me? Probably would have to come up with a more accurate term than dummy.

Dinny

There you go.

[Easy 6]

Pretty damn cool thread, I knew Sorter was a guru but didnt know Sully understood the game to this level... I'm learning a lot from this, great idea Dinny.

I know what a "good football player" looks like, but this is upper deck player/coach level information that I've never understood at all really, many thanks to all involved.

This thing should be stickied.

[Discuss Thrower]

I just want to know about the 3-3-6 defense.

[Sorter]

Originally Posted by Sully

I'm still struggling with this, because the Rush backer is going vs every front, so I don't know what the check rush or check Ed means.

Oh, I think it widens his alignment, the more I look at it.

Okay, here's the full Reduce install with all of the checks vs. motion/alignments



The check Ed is a check to their over ed front. The trips box in the bottom left should clarify things a bit.

[Mother****erJones]

Fantastic thread. I need to study this as well. I need to learn basics also. Like 3-5 and shit lol