Home Mail MemberMap Chat (0) Wallpapers
Go Back   ChiefsPlanet > The Lounge

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-08-2012, 08:55 PM  
Dr. Facebook Fever Dr. Facebook Fever is offline
stax of wax
 
Dr. Facebook Fever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Casino cash: $5000
Manziel wins Heisman

Surely this is a Q right? I was surprised I didn't see a thread. Te'o second, Klein 3rd. I'm sure it's a Q. Oh well, it's football news... and I don't even follow college football.


http://espn.go.com/college-football/...heisman-trophy
Posts: 34,877
Dr. Facebook Fever 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliDr. Facebook Fever 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliDr. Facebook Fever 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliDr. Facebook Fever 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliDr. Facebook Fever 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliDr. Facebook Fever 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliDr. Facebook Fever 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliDr. Facebook Fever 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliDr. Facebook Fever 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliDr. Facebook Fever 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliDr. Facebook Fever 's adopt a chief was Sabby Piscitelli
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2012, 10:36 PM   #46
O.city O.city is offline
Gonzo = Sexy Bitch
 
O.city's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jul 2009
Casino cash: $19308
I was actually thinkin about this the other day DJ. There is so many variety ways to win in the NCAA.

Bama pretty much wins by playing Marty ball, same with LSU. Oregon track meets you.
Posts: 31,524
O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2012, 10:40 PM   #47
DJ's left nut DJ's left nut is offline
Gonna take a break for awhile.
 
DJ's left nut's Avatar
 

Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Columbia, Mo
Casino cash: $5000
Quote:
Originally Posted by keg in kc View Post
Why take the time to rebut when I already wrote a paragraph about it in the post immediately above yours.

I don't think Te'o is anything particularly special. I do think that front 7 was. I don't think he deserved the award, and I don't think it's any miscarriage of justice that he didn't get it. In fact, I think the only reason he was there is that every Notre Dame broadcast for the latter half of the season was primarily focused on talking him up. You'd think there weren't any other players on that defense. Or on that team, for that matter. It's the Manti Te'o show! And you'd think he cured cancer and brought us world peace between commercial breaks. He's a good player that was/is part of a great defense. He was not a Heisman caliber player. The lack of a clear front-runner for the award this year is likely the only reason he was even part of the discussion.

But I will also note that I vehemently hate Notre Dame, and I make no effort at all to hide that bias.
NFL mindset applied to a college game.

"If you're not getting sacks or a QB, you don't count..."

That's not how the college game is played. Te'o's ability to be a force against the run while being the best coverage linebacker in the country makes him the most complete defensive player in the nation and absolutely a Heisman worthy player.
__________________
If you can't draw a crowd, draw dicks on the wall.

2013 Adopt-A-Chief: AJ Jenkins, WR #13
Posts: 19,563
DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2012, 10:42 PM   #48
O.city O.city is offline
Gonzo = Sexy Bitch
 
O.city's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jul 2009
Casino cash: $19308
Yeah, Teo absolutely does all those things.


And I still hope like hell we don't do something stupid and take him first overall this year.
Posts: 31,524
O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2012, 10:48 PM   #49
DJ's left nut DJ's left nut is offline
Gonna take a break for awhile.
 
DJ's left nut's Avatar
 

Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Columbia, Mo
Casino cash: $5000
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.city View Post
I was actually thinkin about this the other day DJ. There is so many variety ways to win in the NCAA.

Bama pretty much wins by playing Marty ball, same with LSU. Oregon track meets you.
That 'Bama/Georgia game was among the most entertaining football games of any variety I've seen in a decade. 'Bama tried to go throw for throw w/ Georgia and it clearly wasn't going to work so they switched gears in the 2nd half and just went to a ground/pound setup.

Meanwhile Murray and co., just kept attacking downfield and were one unlucky deflection/reception away from being in the title game.

College football is the only pure football left anymore. If you have Trent Richardson, you ride him to a national championship. If your best player is an inside linebacker, you tell your Frosh QB to protect the ball and you play clock-control to an undefeated season. If you have Barkley and the best WR corps in the nation, you fire that !@#$ing pigskin. And the rules are set up in a manner that will let any of those styles win.

It isn't the NFL and the college voters shouldn't treat it as such. They should recognize that, in the NCAA, a middle linebacker like Te'o can absolutely be as critical and integral to a teams success as its quarterback can.
__________________
If you can't draw a crowd, draw dicks on the wall.

2013 Adopt-A-Chief: AJ Jenkins, WR #13
Posts: 19,563
DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2012, 10:51 PM   #50
Raiderhader Raiderhader is offline
SteelSkull
 
Raiderhader's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Strawberry Hill
Casino cash: $11851
Quote:
Originally Posted by keg in kc View Post
Why are you talking about multiple seasons in a conversation about the heisman?
The question posed was who I thought was the better player, not who had the better season. And besides, during the show tonight the Game Day crew was throwing up stats that covered both of CK's seasons as starter. I am pretty sure that all three of them are voters. So if it is a relevant point to the voters I do not see why it wouldn't be in this discussion.

Quote:
Anyway, my point was mainly that the press had talked up what I believe is an undeserving player (Te'o) at an undeserving position (ILB) and that I was glad he didn't win. I would have been gladder had he not been there at all, but I'll take what I can get. Notre Dame was undefeated, so they were going to have a name in the discussion. Maybe they'd have won if you could nominate their front 7 as a group, but in any case, I think it was a joke that Te'o even got votes.

As far as Manziel goes, it's kind of hard to talk down the statistical significance of his performance this year. I think it was in general a year where we didn't really have a single stand-out player, a clear "that's the heisman winner" player, but I do think of the players on the list, he was the most deserving.
Fair enough. My point was that the press' love of the SEC talked about JM's win against 'bama while ignoring two home losses and then talked about CK's Baylor loss and while ignoring eleven wins. Not to mention the fact that at least a portion of the voters didn't wait to see the eleventh win. How people can vote with one week of football left is beyond me.

I am not saying that Klein should or should not have won. You can make a case for either of the QBs that were there tonight. I just want to throw a question out there: does Johnny Football win the award as a freshman if he is in any other conference?
__________________
"Serious sport has nothing to do with fair play. It is bound up with hatred, jealousy, boastfulness, and disregard of all the rules."

-- George Orwell, Shooting an Elephant
Posts: 18,005
Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2012, 10:51 PM   #51
DJ's left nut DJ's left nut is offline
Gonna take a break for awhile.
 
DJ's left nut's Avatar
 

Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Columbia, Mo
Casino cash: $5000
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.city View Post
Yeah, Teo absolutely does all those things.


And I still hope like hell we don't do something stupid and take him first overall this year.
Jesus, no. Like I said - different games.

What he does is huge at that level. And if this were the mid-1970s it would be huge here.

But there's no question that his game, while it translates extremely well to the next level, isn't nearly as important as getting your pass rush and your quarterback in place.

That's why I've said I'd trade back into the first for him if he started sliding. If we take Geno, and with Houston and Hali in the fold, we have the QB and the pass rush taken care of. So now you address your intermediate coverage, your leadership and firm up your run-stopping by taking Te'o.
__________________
If you can't draw a crowd, draw dicks on the wall.

2013 Adopt-A-Chief: AJ Jenkins, WR #13
Posts: 19,563
DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2012, 10:53 PM   #52
O.city O.city is offline
Gonzo = Sexy Bitch
 
O.city's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jul 2009
Casino cash: $19308
QB, LT, Pass Rushers and monster WR's (if I already have the other 3) are about the only things I'm taking in the top 5.

If somehow Teo were to be available late teens I'd think about trading back up, but I also think there are LB's who can do what he would do at the next level, or atleast adequately do it, later in the draft.
Posts: 31,524
O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.O.city has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2012, 11:14 PM   #53
RunKC RunKC is online now
Just a humble bounty hunter
 
RunKC's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2012
Casino cash: $12185
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.city View Post
QB, LT, Pass Rushers and monster WR's (if I already have the other 3) are about the only things I'm taking in the top 5.

If somehow Teo were to be available late teens I'd think about trading back up, but I also think there are LB's who can do what he would do at the next level, or atleast adequately do it, later in the draft.
And a dominant DB.

I'd rather get Geno/Wilson at 1 and then get Alec Ogletree in round 2.
Posts: 6,437
RunKC 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliRunKC 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliRunKC 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliRunKC 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliRunKC 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliRunKC 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliRunKC 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliRunKC 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliRunKC 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliRunKC 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliRunKC 's adopt a chief was Sabby Piscitelli
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2012, 11:40 PM   #54
Kerberos Kerberos is offline
Chiefs Baby
 
Kerberos's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Henderson, NV
Casino cash: $5517
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mi_chief_fan View Post
Simple question: do you believe Klein is a better player than Manziel?
Absolutely...Klein got robbed because KSU will NEVER get the respect they deserve until they can get into the BCS title game. PERIOD.
__________________
____________________________________________


She aint a hoe if you don't get laid, and it aint a show if I don't get paid-- Everlast
Posts: 5,623
Kerberos must have mowed badgirl's lawn.Kerberos must have mowed badgirl's lawn.Kerberos must have mowed badgirl's lawn.Kerberos must have mowed badgirl's lawn.Kerberos must have mowed badgirl's lawn.Kerberos must have mowed badgirl's lawn.Kerberos must have mowed badgirl's lawn.Kerberos must have mowed badgirl's lawn.Kerberos must have mowed badgirl's lawn.Kerberos must have mowed badgirl's lawn.Kerberos must have mowed badgirl's lawn.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2012, 11:42 PM   #55
keg in kc keg in kc is online now
oxymoron
 
keg in kc's Avatar
 

Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: OP/KC/Whatever
Casino cash: $11034
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut View Post
NFL mindset applied to a college game.

"If you're not getting sacks or a QB, you don't count..."
I don't believe I said either of those things.

I think Te'o is a good player on one of the best college front 7s I can ever remember seeing. I don't think he's a great player and I think the team would excel without him. I don't think he's anywhere close to being a dominant player like, say, Ndamukong Suh, who was what, 4th in Heisman voting that year (now that was a travesty). I think he's ultimately just one of what will be a bunch of NFL players off of that front 7. As I said, I think it's about the greatness of the unit, not the player.

This was a weird year, in any case. I'd probably have voted for Marqise Lee. Thought he was hands down the best player I saw this year. Although it's hard to vote against Manziel. Both the yardage and the freshman thing. And I think there's very little doubt just how valuable he was to that team.

The award is too much a popularity contest and too much about wins and losses. You see it in this thread, where people are complaining about a quarterback winning because his team lost TWO games. Geno Smith isn't even on the ballot with a 4000-yard, 40 TD, 6 INT season, but his teammate Tavon Austin is? Because Smith's the face of a team that lost five times? (I'm not saying he should have won, just making the point...) Isn't the award supposed to be for the most outstanding player in college football? Or is it the most outstanding player on an team that goes undefeated or loses once in college football? It's like you can't be outstanding if your team loses. There were people a year ago complaining about a 3-loss Baylor QB winning it. I guess it's not about being the best. It's about being on the best team. That's why Smith lost the award (and wasn't even in NYC) once WVU lost. That's why Collin Klein went from front-runner to also ran...with one loss.
Posts: 52,083
keg in kc is obviously part of the inner Circle.keg in kc is obviously part of the inner Circle.keg in kc is obviously part of the inner Circle.keg in kc is obviously part of the inner Circle.keg in kc is obviously part of the inner Circle.keg in kc is obviously part of the inner Circle.keg in kc is obviously part of the inner Circle.keg in kc is obviously part of the inner Circle.keg in kc is obviously part of the inner Circle.keg in kc is obviously part of the inner Circle.keg in kc is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2012, 11:53 PM   #56
big nasty kcnut big nasty kcnut is offline
Hey wanna fight!
 
big nasty kcnut's Avatar
 

Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: wichita kansas u.s.a.
Casino cash: $8055
Klein was robbed. I'll post my reason when I get home.
Posted via Mobile Device
Posts: 12,706
big nasty kcnut has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.big nasty kcnut has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.big nasty kcnut has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.big nasty kcnut has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.big nasty kcnut has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.big nasty kcnut has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.big nasty kcnut has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.big nasty kcnut has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.big nasty kcnut has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.big nasty kcnut has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.big nasty kcnut has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2012, 11:54 PM   #57
DJ's left nut DJ's left nut is offline
Gonna take a break for awhile.
 
DJ's left nut's Avatar
 

Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Columbia, Mo
Casino cash: $5000
I agree with you - there's now too much emphasis on W/L.

In a timely example - Bo Jackson won the Heisman in a year that Auburn lost 4 games and finished something like 5th in their conference.

Won't happen again.

I also agree that Marqise Lee should've been there.

Like I said - I've lost all semblance of give a !@#$ about the Heisman at this point. In fact, I was pretty sure I stopped caring last season when Montee Ball was essentially ignored despite having one of the greatest rushing seasons in NCAA history. Why? Because people didn't think he'd be a great pro.

He led the nation in rushing, had a better YPC than Richardson and scored 39 freakin' touchdowns. And he was a complete afterthought. He finished behind a guy he clearly had a better season than primarily because that guy (Richardson) was a better pro prospect.

The Heisman is a racket at this point.
__________________
If you can't draw a crowd, draw dicks on the wall.

2013 Adopt-A-Chief: AJ Jenkins, WR #13
Posts: 19,563
DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.DJ's left nut is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2012, 11:56 PM   #58
GoChargers GoChargers is offline
Vincent Who?
 
GoChargers's Avatar
 

Join Date: Oct 2012
Casino cash: $7617
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut View Post
Te'o should've won it and it shouldn't have been close. He showed up and dominated every game, every half.
56th in the nation in tackles, not even top 100 in forced fumbles or tackles for loss, 681st in sacks. What exactly was he dominating again? He didn't even lead his own team in tackles for loss, QB hurries, or sacks.

Jarvis Jones was truly the best linebacker in the nation this year and didn't even get consideration. Hell, Anthony Barr from UCLA has a legit argument for best LB as well. Manti Te'o didn't belong anywhere near the Heisman ceremony tonight, let alone actually winning the award.
__________________


Posts: 2,235
GoChargers 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliGoChargers 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliGoChargers 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliGoChargers 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliGoChargers 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliGoChargers 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliGoChargers 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliGoChargers 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliGoChargers 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliGoChargers 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliGoChargers 's adopt a chief was Sabby Piscitelli
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-09-2012, 12:03 AM   #59
Bewbies Bewbies is offline
Where's the flag ref?
 
Bewbies's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2010
Casino cash: $8222
The Heisman is an offensive award.

This place is full of weeping pussies.
Posts: 6,598
Bewbies is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Bewbies is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Bewbies is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Bewbies is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Bewbies is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Bewbies is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Bewbies is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Bewbies is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Bewbies is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Bewbies is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Bewbies is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-09-2012, 12:40 AM   #60
Raiderhader Raiderhader is offline
SteelSkull
 
Raiderhader's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Strawberry Hill
Casino cash: $11851
Quote:
Originally Posted by keg in kc View Post
The award is too much a popularity contest and too much about wins and losses. You see it in this thread, where people are complaining about a quarterback winning because his team lost TWO games. Geno Smith isn't even on the ballot with a 4000-yard, 40 TD, 6 INT season, but his teammate Tavon Austin is? Because Smith's the face of a team that lost five times? (I'm not saying he should have won, just making the point...) Isn't the award supposed to be for the most outstanding player in college football? Or is it the most outstanding player on an team that goes undefeated or loses once in college football? It's like you can't be outstanding if your team loses. There were people a year ago complaining about a 3-loss Baylor QB winning it. I guess it's not about being the best. It's about being on the best team. That's why Smith lost the award (and wasn't even in NYC) once WVU lost. That's why Collin Klein went from front-runner to also ran...with one loss.

This. And even more to the point, it changes from year to year, and some times even changes during the season. We always hear about how a certain player needs their team to go undefeated and once they lose they are more or less out of it. Then last year we have, as you pointed out, a winner from a three loss team. This year we hear that Klein has to go undefeated to be able to win. He loses one game (and still finishes the regular season with a conference title, a top 5 team and playing in a BCS bowl). So then a two game loser wins the trophy?

There is no consistency in the requirements. It is all about who the media decides they want to win.
__________________
"Serious sport has nothing to do with fair play. It is bound up with hatred, jealousy, boastfulness, and disregard of all the rules."

-- George Orwell, Shooting an Elephant
Posts: 18,005
Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.Raiderhader 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.
  Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:26 PM.


This is a test for a client's site.
A new website that shows member-created construction site listings that need fill or have excess fill. Dirt Monkey @ https://DirtMonkey.net
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.