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Old 04-01-2012, 04:23 PM  
keg in kc keg in kc is offline
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Game of Thrones *Spoiler* Thread

There's been some recent confusion with the old spoiler thread, so I'm kicking off a new one for tonight's premiere. This is going to be the one for folks who've read all the books. So anything anybody might want to talk about is in bounds. Suffice to say, if you haven't read the books, you'll probably want to stay out of here until you do...

I'll bump the old spoiler-free thread shortly in case anybody's interested. For future reference the link to that one is here
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Old 04-16-2012, 05:22 PM   #121
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Originally Posted by petegz28 View Post
Not having the Reeds ****s it all up. That's a huge mistake if they do that.
I agree
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Old 04-17-2012, 02:00 AM   #122
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Originally Posted by petegz28 View Post
Not having the Reeds ****s it all up. That's a huge mistake if they do that.
I like them, but I wouldn't say it's a huge mistake so much as a disappointment for me. They're not exactly vital characters and the latest books haven't done much to increase their importance the way I had imagined it would increase when I first read Clash.
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Old 04-17-2012, 07:31 AM   #123
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Old 04-17-2012, 07:34 AM   #124
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I like them, but I wouldn't say it's a huge mistake so much as a disappointment for me. They're not exactly vital characters and the latest books haven't done much to increase their importance the way I had imagined it would increase when I first read Clash.
Agreed, they seem to go nowhere as characters in the end, especially if Bran basically becomes part of the weirwood trees like the other guy. Jojen is about to die, and Meera will be left pretty much on her own in the far far north. Kind of depressing really. Granted, that may change in future books, but from what we've seen so far, I could understand the decision to leave them out to save money on casting (this cast is already huge and getting huger) and to avoid having soooo many characters that audiences have to learn and care about, and to leave off a couple of sad character arcs.
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Old 04-17-2012, 10:31 AM   #125
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Loved the interaction between Tyrion, Shagga and Bronn this week.

"There are no goats here, halfman!"

"Well, make do!"

Fantastic, and great, great work by Peter Dinklage.

I like the Reeds, but I think cutting them from the show was smart (just like making Bronn the captain of the city watch). It compacts the story and reduces the number of characters to keep track of, important things for TV. It also lets them lean even more heavily on Bran's "special nature" than Martin does. Which will be cool for that character's development.
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Old 04-18-2012, 12:36 PM   #126
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I loved it when she asked him if he wanted her brother to get him started or if he wanted her to turn over so he could pretend she was Loras. Awesome!
Such a great scene! I really like getting to see more of the characters on screen that don't have POVs in the books. I love how Martin keeps planting that Margery is an expert player in the game of thrones; she knows so much more and appears to be more than she seems.The show is doing a great job of fleshing her out (no pun intended!) as well as Renly, Robb and Varis.

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They did a good job handling Tyrion's little game which could have been very confusing but wasn't. Pycell's beard being cut follows the book, as does his admission to being involved in John Arryn's death which is what started everything when Robert replaced him with Ned.
I think this scene along with Arya and Yoren, Sansa and Cersei at dinner and Varis's speech to Tyrion are among some of the strongest scenes in the series so far. This was a really great character episode. It set up a lot without feeling like exposition. It had a great pace and a wonderful sense of tension throughout. I don't think it ever got confusing or contrived.

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We are at the part where the Reed siblings would come in if they are going to, so I guess we'll find out in the next episode or two whether they will even have those characters. The conversation between Bran and Maester Luwin was almost word for word from the book.
Yeah, I loved how word for word that scene was. I was smiling from ear to ear. I'm not missing the Reeds at all. If they don't end up in this thing, I'll be fine with that cut.

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Theon's part was also well done I thought. They covered a lot in a short time as far as understanding Theon. He really is stuck a bit between competing loyalties, and you can't blame him for siding with his family I guess, but his ultimate actions are still unforgivable.
I still hate the ****er. But showing the burning of the letter was a master stroke. Really helps add some sympathy to Theon. And he's gonna need as much as he can get moving forward. That shot of him burning the letter was so gorgeous. Just Theon and the letter surrounded by complete, blackness. This show doesn't get enough credit for being pretty. I'd hang that scene in a frame on my wall.

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Arya's part was good too, Yoren was great, killing a bunch of them after getting shot by the arrow.
I already miss Yoren. That's one thing about the show that sucks, I have to watch these people die all over again. Boo! Also, in the book, I can't remember, does Yoren tell Arya about saying his brother's name every night before bed? Does he give her that idea? I didn't recall that in the book and that blew my mind last night. I thought that was a wonderful way to take something internal and make it external. And it's a great way to sort of honor Yoren as well. Just awesome.

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The differences from the book are actually good to me. They advance the plot in the right way most of the time to remain consistent with the book, but they keep it interesting for me.
Agreed.
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Old 04-18-2012, 01:32 PM   #127
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Yoren does not tell Arya that in the book, and their relatiosnship was not as close seeming as the on-screen relationship. In the book, he whips her legs so hard with the side of his sword after she beats up Lommy or Hot Pie (I forget which) that she bleeds. He doesn't listen to her when she says they should not stay at the keep, and she's too scared of him to really argue further, then he dies. The name prayer of people she wants dead is not Yoren's idea, she just starts doing it so she won't forget them.

I like the show Yoren much better, and their relationship was better. I liked him telling her about the names and thought that worked well to explain why she does it because otherwise, since she does it alone, she'd have to talk to herself or something. She may do that anyway, but it will give it a little more impact, especially when she does it even after Yoren told her how it drove him crazy and then caused him to have to run to the wall.
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Old 04-18-2012, 01:45 PM   #128
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Yoren does not tell Arya that in the book, and their relatiosnship was not as close seeming as the on-screen relationship. In the book, he whips her legs so hard with the side of his sword after she beats up Lommy or Hot Pie (I forget which) that she bleeds. He doesn't listen to her when she says they should not stay at the keep, and she's too scared of him to really argue further, then he dies. The name prayer of people she wants dead is not Yoren's idea, she just starts doing it so she won't forget them.

I like the show Yoren much better, and their relationship was better. I liked him telling her about the names and thought that worked well to explain why she does it because otherwise, since she does it alone, she'd have to talk to herself or something. She may do that anyway, but it will give it a little more impact, especially when she does it even after Yoren told her how it drove him crazy and then caused him to have to run to the wall.
Exactly. I loved the device. I didn't think Yoren did that in the book. But it was a brilliant way to take something that is revealed internally in the book and make it an external conversation. Great writing. Great device.

I'd kinda forgotten how big of dick Yoren is in the books. Or rather, how tough he is on Arya.
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Old 04-18-2012, 04:22 PM   #129
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After finishing the first 2 books, I've concluded I only want Jon and Arya to live. The rest can die, especially Sansa. I was tired of her character halfway through A Game of Thrones.
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Old 04-18-2012, 04:58 PM   #130
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Does anyone think it may be foreshadowing that all of the Starks, even Jon, have POV chapters except Robb and Rickon? Robb is not a POV because none of the kings in the story have ever been POV's. Rickon may just be too young for one, or perhaps he has not had a POV because he is the one destined to be king?

Sansa grew on me a little as the books went on. Still not my favorite, but something tells me she's going to be a major player, and her character does develop some. Plus even though her personality can be annoying because she's so uppity (especially on the show) she has been put in a pretty tough situation throughout.
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Old 04-18-2012, 09:46 PM   #131
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After finishing the first 2 books, I've concluded I only want Jon and Arya to live. The rest can die, especially Sansa. I was tired of her character halfway through A Game of Thrones.
Oh, my! We all might be dissappointed on this number.

I personally think Sansa is a great character. She is strong and tough like her mother, and endures a lot of crap while keeping her composure most of the time. Sure it's fun to see a character that refuses to put on any pretext (or perhaps isn't capable of doing so) like Arya, but I respect Sansa's choice of honoring her family by staying a noble lady in all occassions regardless of how insanely horrible they are. In Clash, she single handedly saves Dontos' life... and later she is a big part of the BEST event to happen yet in a Song of Ice and Fire, IMO. Okay...maybe she isn't more than a vessel in that event, but the way it all works out and the way the "mastermind," is revealed afterward was the most jawdropping moment in the entire series for me. BTW - If she pulls off the marriage that's brewing in the latest books, then she and her new husband may just become significant players in the "game." I definitely hope Sansa doesn't die, but I know I may be in the minority with that opinion.

All that said, I hope to see Jon and Ayra alive in the next books as well, and for good reason, I'm really not getting my hopes up for that.

When I was reading the books, Tyrion was the one character that I didn't want to see die. However, if he were to die with most perfect heroic death- (thinking of that "perfect moment to die" that Walter White talks about in Breaking Bad)... it's already come and gone. I don't want to spoil everything (even if this is the Spoiler thread), but there was a moment in the books where I would have been totally fine with Tyrion dying, but alas... he lived! Now, he may end up in a totally depressing way instead. But who knows...
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Old 04-18-2012, 09:50 PM   #132
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Oh, my! We all might be dissappointed on this number.

I personally think Sansa is a great character. She is strong and tough like her mother, and endures a lot of crap while keeping her composure most of the time. Sure it's fun to see a character that refuses to put on any pretext (or perhaps isn't capable of doing so) like Arya, but I respect Sansa's choice of honoring her family by staying a noble lady in all occassions regardless of how insanely horrible they are. In Clash, she single handedly saves Dontos' life... and later she is a big part of the BEST event to happen yet in a Song of Ice and Fire, IMO. Okay...maybe she isn't more than a vessel in that event, but the way it all works out and the way the "mastermind," is revealed afterward was the most jawdropping moment in the entire series for me. BTW - If she pulls off the marriage that's brewing in the latest books, then she and her new husband may just become significant players in the "game." I definitely hope Sansa doesn't die, but I know I may be in the minority with that opinion.

All that said, I hope to see Jon and Ayra alive in the next books as well, and for good reason, I'm really not getting my hopes up for that.

When I was reading the books, Tyrion was the one character that I didn't want to see die. However, if he were to die with most perfect heroic death- (thinking of that "perfect moment to die" that Walter White talks about in Breaking Bad)... it's already come and gone. I don't want to spoil everything (even if this is the Spoiler thread), but there was a moment in the books where I would have been totally fine with Tyrion dying, but alas... he lived! Now, he may end up in a totally depressing way instead. But who knows...

Not sure if I care whether Sansa lives or dies...but her storyline is very intriguing, and I am very interested in seeing where it goes in the next book.
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Old 04-18-2012, 09:57 PM   #133
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Does anyone think it may be foreshadowing that all of the Starks, even Jon, have POV chapters except Robb and Rickon? Robb is not a POV because none of the kings in the story have ever been POV's. Rickon may just be too young for one, or perhaps he has not had a POV because he is the one destined to be king?

Sansa grew on me a little as the books went on. Still not my favorite, but something tells me she's going to be a major player, and her character does develop some. Plus even though her personality can be annoying because she's so uppity (especially on the show) she has been put in a pretty tough situation throughout.
I think you've got the right idea about the POV's as it pertains to Rob, but when it comes to Rickon... I honestly have no clue. He's the one question mark that we've had very little answers about. I was hoping he'd have come into play with the Onion Knight already, but alas... no.
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Old 04-19-2012, 01:00 PM   #134
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I don't understand the dislike for Sansa. IMHO she is one of the strongest and most pitiable characters in the entire storyline. A noble daughter raised in a strong house suddenly having her world swept from beneath her feet. She finds herself fatherless, unprotected, held captive to a cruel and bitter boy/king and the machinations of his evil mother.
I root for Sansa and want to see her come out on top.
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Old 04-19-2012, 01:17 PM   #135
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Initially, I disliked Sansa because she was a whiny, entitled brat. And because I love Arya so much that I saw Sansa through Arya's eyes a little bit. Then Sansa has to endure so much. She grows up pretty quickly and I greatly sympathize with her as the story advances. Now she's one of the characters I root for. For sure. But it took a bit to get me there.
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