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Old 11-01-2013, 04:26 PM  
Taco John Taco John is offline
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Americans Keep Moving to States With Low Taxes and Housing Costs

Americans Keep Moving to States With Low Taxes and Housing Costs

Where are Americans moving, and why? Timothy Noah, writing in the Washington Monthly, professes to be puzzled. He points out that people have been moving out of states with high per capita incomes -- Connecticut, New York, Massachusetts, Maryland -- to states with lower income levels.

"Why are Americans by and large moving away from economic opportunity rather than toward it?" he asks.

Actually, it's not puzzling at all. The movement from high-tax, high-housing-cost states to low-tax, low-housing-cost states has been going on for more than 40 years, as I note in my new book Shaping Our Nation: How Surges of Migration Transformed America and Its Politics.

Between 1970 and 2010, the population of New York state increased from 18 million to 19 million. In that same period, the population of Texas increased from 11 million to 25 million.

The picture is even starker if you look at major metro areas. The New York metropolitan area, including counties in New Jersey and Connecticut, increased from 17.8 million in 1970 to 19.2 million in 2010 -- up 8 percent. During that time, the nation grew 52 percent.

In the same period, the four big metro areas in Texas -- Dallas, Houston, San Antonio, Austin -- grew from 6 million to 15.6 million, a 160 percent increase.

Contrary to Noah's inference, people don't move away from opportunity. They move partly in response to economic incentives, but also to pursue dreams and escape nightmares.

Opportunity does exist in the Northeastern states and in California -- for people with very high skill levels and for low-skill immigrants, without whom those metro areas would have lost, rather than gained, population over the last three decades.

But there's not much opportunity there for people with midlevel skills who want to raise families. Housing costs are exceedingly high, partly, as Noah notes, because of restrictive land use and zoning regulations.

And central city public schools, with a few exceptions, repel most middle-class parents.

High taxes produce revenues to finance handsome benefits and pensions for public employee union members in the high-cost states. It's hard to see how this benefits middle-class people making their livings in the private sector.

Moreover, Noah's use of per capita incomes is misleading, since children typically have no income and many in the Northeast and coastal California are childless. If you look at household incomes, these states are far closer to the national average.

As economist Tyler Cowen points out in a Time magazine cover story, when you adjust incomes for tax rates and cost of living, Texas comes out ahead of California and New York and ranks behind only Virginia and Washington state (which, like Texas, has no state income tax).

Critics charge that Texas's growth depends on the oil and gas industries and is weighted toward low-wage jobs. But in fact, Texas's low-tax, light-regulation policies have produced a highly diversified economy that from 2002 to 2011 created nearly one-third of the nation's highest-paying jobs. In those years, its number of upper- and middle-income jobs grew 24 percent.

Liberals like Noah often decry income inequality. But the states with the most unequal incomes and highest poverty levels these days are California and New York. That's what happens when high taxes and housing costs squeeze out the middle class.

As Noah notes, "Few working-class people earn enough money to live anywhere near San Francisco."

This leaves a highly visible and articulate upper class willing, in line with their liberal beliefs, to shoulder high tax burdens and a very much larger lower class -- many of them immigrants -- available to serve them in restaurants, landscape their gardens and valet-park their cars.

There's nothing wrong with living in a high-rise, restaurant-studded, subway-served neighborhood (I do). It's great that America offers more such options than one and two generations ago.

But it's foolish to try to cram everyone into such surroundings, as the Obama Department of Housing and Urban Development (as Terry Eastland reports in the Weekly Standard) and California Governor, Jerry Brown, are trying to do.

Noah notes correctly that fewer Americans have been moving recently. That's always true in times of economic distress (the Okies' trek along U.S. Route 66 to California's Central Valley in the 1930s was a memorable exception, not the rule).

But they continue to move to the low-tax states that are providing jobs and living space where they can pursue their dreams and escape places that burden them with high costs and provide few middle-class amenities in return.



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Old 11-02-2013, 02:46 PM   #31
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Gotta love the Federalist style of government. The market always gets the last say when people vote with their actions.
As President Reagan said they would.
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Old 11-02-2013, 03:01 PM   #32
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does this mean more Detroit like situations will happen?

Those that can afford it-move to areas where they can earn the same amount, pay less taxes and leave economic redistribution behind.

Those that can't get taxed beyond belief and live in run down areas. Less services are offered and high poverty sets in.

I don't see a mass exodus of people happening but have heard that places like Arizona have had large move ins from Cali. And Detroit lost half its population from the 1950's.

or am I way off?

ps-I would not live anywhere but in the midwest. Values, cost of living, saftey from natural disasters.
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Old 11-02-2013, 03:26 PM   #33
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I moved from Illinois to Indiana to. Colorado to Indiana to Missouri. See a trend? If I moved it would be to lower tax lower housing. Texas or South Carolina.

I stay for the turkey hunting, deer hunting and low cost of living. Id hate to live in Illinois or Colorado again. And i have former employees who live in Nebraska and Iowa who suffer under excessive taxes. **** that.

If you dont think people will move to save money or get away from insane political places like California , NY, and the PNW you are nuts
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Old 11-02-2013, 03:41 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by Bob Dole View Post
Bob Dole's has no family in Texas or Nevada, the two states he has lived in since leaving Missouri.

Guess what those 2 states have in common?
They are both in the Unitied States.
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Old 11-02-2013, 03:52 PM   #35
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If any of you do ever move to the DC area, you will laugh your ass off the first time you see people panic-drive in the snow. Of course, the second and subsequent times you'll want to throw yourself bodily from the nearest bridge, but that first time will be hilarious.
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Old 11-02-2013, 04:02 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Dole View Post
Bob Dole's has no family in Texas or Nevada, the two states he has lived in since leaving Missouri.

Guess what those 2 states have in common?
There used to have decent college football teams? You can now return to Missouri. There decent enough now.
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Old 11-02-2013, 04:09 PM   #37
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If any of you do ever move to the DC area, you will laugh your ass off the first time you see people panic-drive in the snow. Of course, the second and subsequent times you'll want to throw yourself bodily from the nearest bridge, but that first time will be hilarious.
Its also enormously expensive and the diplomats don't give a crap how they drive. There isn't really an endearing culture there either. Almost everybody is a transplant. The natives went west and south.
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Old 11-02-2013, 04:15 PM   #38
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They are both in the Unitied States.
State income tax. And a history of crooks like LBJ and Harry Reid. Billy Sol Estes was a good un too. Rick Perry has Texas on the right path but the big money progressives will stop at nothing to beat him with yuppie and mexican vote
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Old 11-02-2013, 04:53 PM   #39
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Its also enormously expensive and the diplomats don't give a crap how they drive. There isn't really an endearing culture there either. Almost everybody is a transplant. The natives went west and south.
There's actually tons of culture, most of which is along the lines of museums, monuments, and so on, but there's also a pretty good nightlife, lots of activities, and accessible to both the coast and the mountains. That's not the problem here at all. The problems are, as you mentioned, the insane cost of living and the traffic - which will blow your mind how bad it gets - but also the crime rate and the weather.

You're totally right about the transplants. That's how my family got here; my Dad moved us here from KC when I was four because he got a job in the National Press Building. Growing up here, I got used to there being fans around of just about every NFL team - this person is a 49ers fan, that one is a Dolphins fan, whatever. When I moved to Indianapolis, though, everyone was a Colts fan. It was weird to see, until I thought about it and realized it's the disparity of the DC area fan allegiances that's so unusual, because there are people from so many different areas.
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Old 11-02-2013, 05:02 PM   #40
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ps-I would not live anywhere but in the midwest. Values, cost of living, saftey from natural disasters.
Unless you are a tornado chaser for a living.
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Old 11-02-2013, 05:07 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by HonestChieffan View Post
State income tax. And a history of crooks like LBJ and Harry Reid. Billy Sol Estes was a good un too. Rick Perry has Texas on the right path but the big money progressives will stop at nothing to beat him with yuppie and mexican vote

I knew the obvious answer but was just trying to inject a little humor in the thread.
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Old 11-02-2013, 05:46 PM   #42
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Unless you are a tornado chaser for a living.
Never have, but maybe someday.
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Old 11-02-2013, 09:08 PM   #43
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There are states that don't have income tax?
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Old 11-02-2013, 09:11 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aries Walker View Post
There are states that don't have income tax?
Washington State doesn't have an income tax, but they keep trying...
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Old 11-02-2013, 09:12 PM   #45
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There are states that don't have income tax?
TN has no income tax either.
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