Draw Your Line
 

There's lots of people here who don't mind Clark's history or Hunt and Hill's history either. There's some here who do. Where do you draw the line?

Is it conviction?
Is it "cops called, reports filed"?
Is it multiple incidents?
Is an allegation from college enough?

Is it cultural? Some people were raised to spank their kids and see nothing wrong with a "board of education". Others will scream "Child Abuse" and want to take kids out of the home and throw them into the foster care system.
If you grew up seeing mom and dad fighting how long do you get to figure out that's not how it's supposed to be before you are accountable? What's the appropriate level of punishment?
Polls are to rigid, just looking for your answers.

I’m not sure what line we’re talking about, but I think I draw it at conviction or insubordination.

I may be an outlier, but I think that off the field stuff should stay off the field. If a guy gets put in jail and can't play, then he crossed the line. But taking action on anything else is the NFL just doing public relations and generally mangling it.

I absolutely despise what Michael Vick did, and I was glad that he didn't sign with the Chiefs, but in the end the off-field stuff was handled and he's got a right to earn a living after that. I feel the same way about any other player or any other worker in America.

I guess it's the employer's right to fire an employee if the employee is publicly doing stuff that the employer doesn't like, or that might hurt the employer's business, but come on. This is the NFL. A few whiny fans will boycott until their team is in the playoffs, and then they'll be back.

This.

I don't watch football because the players are great human beings. I watch because it's fun to see some amazing athletes do things I could only dream of.

I don't care what someone does off the field, good or bad--everyone calling for Hill's head would not advocate keeping someone like Alex Smith on the team just because he visits hospitals or raises money for charities or whatever.

Rainman, after meeting you at a draft party at your house many years ago I agree you are an outlier but that doesn't make you abnormal in this situation. I expect to find many who think along these lines including myself.

I believe people screw up, what they do after is who they are. If you mess up deal with the consequences and try to change the behavior. I can forgive the action and the person can redeem themselves.

Probably Aaron Hernandez is where I draw the line.

Bring him in for a look?

I draw the line where it puts all three on the losing side of the line.
I despise men who are cowards that clobber women or hurt children.
All three are guilty of being low life individuals.

Don’t give a shit at all what athletes do off the field.

I don't really hold them as role models as an adult, but I get the side that says they need to be held to a higher standard.

I think it's kind of ****ed up that they can get suspended or in trouble in situations where they aren't actually in legal trouble. Moreso about what it says about society and the law than the league I guess.

Innocent until proven guilty-that's always my line

I am a Father I love my kids I never want to harm come to them or any other kid. I cant fathom how a mother or father could intentionally harm there child. I have no compassion for someone who does.

But I dont think this was fair to drop charges but convict in court of public opinion. Howe knows that JO Ks. is a very family oriented community and this deal could make or break his political aspirations. So he pussed out to take to trial for fear of failure and convicted in public opinion to save face and his career. Thats what I think anyway.

Somebody mentioned this on 810 in regards to Hill. Even though they can't prosecute, Hill is still protecting someone that hurt this child. That alone is a problem whether it's himself or the mother.

No one knows what happened except Tyreek and his wife. All this speculation that he or his wife intentionally hurt the child is ridiculous.

Could it have happened? Yes.
Could one of them have grabbed the kid by the arm and yanked him to make him listen or some other reason and they accidentally broke the kids arm? Yes

I'm not going to make assumptions and cast aspersions like the DA did. That's bullshit.

I dont have a line. The Chiefs could bring in AOC and I wouldn't mind if she helped us win a Superbowl.

That's kind of where I'm at. We don't know if it was Hill, baby mama, or someone else. It appears the DA doesn't either. In Hunt's case, we all saw the video --- multiple times.

I did not say anyone intentionally hurt the child. Just that they are protecting the person that did hurt the child.

This is still America... Innocent until proven guilty. I say conviction. Even Jussie Smollet was arrested and charged, but got off because of politics.

I was beat with ping pong paddles and belts, mouth washed out with soap had to take a bite off a soap bar and now days that would be considered child abuse. I've also been yanked really hard for not listening and I never once thought my parents were abusing me

She's the Sean McVay of Congress

Conviction for domestic assault/abuse is where I lose respect for the player but even then I don't think NFL players should be held to a standard of "role model." Even then, I think there's a huge difference between child abuse and spanking your child as a form of discipline. That's a societal issue though.

We shouldn't allow our children to idolize sports stars in the way that we do. Their role models should be their parents, in reality, and we should strive to be great parents. So, with that said, I don't think playing football should be dependent upon how great of an individual that person is. If they pay their dues to society, that is serve the terms of their conviction, then I have no issue with them being employed by an NFL team.

I don't think though, that it should be the right of the NFL to intervene and suspend the player. The team should be able to suspend it's employee should they see fit and that is where it should end, same as any employer suspending an employee for insubordination and other infractions (such as use of street drugs). The State they live in isn't suspending them from work, for example, but that's how the NFL currently operates.

I think the only things the NFL should have oversight of in terms of suspensions and/or penalties is for performance enhancing drugs and team cheating. They should act as a league oversight board, not a court of law and not the employer.

This describes my views perfectly. They control stuff on the field, and let society handles stuff off the field.

She would have thrived in a Trent Green offense.

Kinda how much stuff has changed, I got my ass belt beat several times...had my arm yanked on. All sorts of stuff that people would say is abuse now.

It doesn't matter anymore. If you try to be the good guy and just cut a good player because he's a criminal or did something bad, some other team just gets to swoop him right up for cheap. **** that, there's no honor in the NFL. We released Hunt and the Browns will reap the rewards for that for the 2nd half of the season, down the stretch. If they are still allowed to play in the NFL, then I don't care. There's no image, nobody still says "boy those Chiefs sure are swell because they did the right thing and released Hunt" nobody gives a shit anymore.

One of my favorite childhood stories was when I was probably six or seven years old. I was in the pickup with my mom and I was doing something she didn't like. I don't remember my crime. But she got mad at me and said, "I'm either going to take your allowance this week or I'm going to hit you. Which do you want?"

I said, "Well, go ahead and hit me."

She was mad, so she immediately took the offer and smacked me. Then she started laughing that I did that.

Draw Your Line
 

If a father spanks a six year old child and causes them to get scared and to hurt themselves and need go to the hospital, and when asked at the hospital what happened the kid says something like dad spanked him and scared him, what should the wife say or do when CPS comes calling? Is her protecting the father a problem in this scenario?

I don't go for guilt by assocation. I don't go for suspicion. So my line is that the individual in question has to actually - themselves - be verifiably guilty of something.

But it's different for the League. Actions taken by the NFL aren't about punishment or justice. They're about perception. I only have to worry about my conscience. They have millions of fans, hundreds of advertisers and endless media scrutiny.

___________________________

Ok I drew my line now what?

Didn't Leonard Little kill a man while driving drunk, and continued to play? I think the line now moves depending on whether or not there is video evidence.

I mean, if there wasn't video of Ray Rice knocking his wife out cold, he probably would have kept his job. Kareem Hunt would still be on our roster without the video. Allegations without video evidence (or in some cases physical evidence) is just one person's word against another, and it's easy to create narratives and spin the situation into something palatable.

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LMAO

As I've always said, I draw the line at a conviction. I don't think any employer SHOULD have the right to discriminate against someone for a pending charge, crimimal or otherwise.

This. There's this whole thing called 'the law' and the 'judicial system' and if you're in prison, you can't go to work. Otherwise, **** off and get out of the equation.