So Bill Self knew . . . . ?
 

So Coach Self knew about Adidas paying players to come to Kansas??

Article on ESPN.com front page:

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-bas...sa-recruitment

Another new article from ESPN:

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-bas...oach-bill-self

Well, that's not good.

He's got no one but himself to blame...

You’d have to be pretty naive to assume any top program (at the very least) is completely clean. Why would a kid with no true allegiance to any university no go to one that’s going to get them paid right away?

Those texts are pretty damning. Will KU fire him?

Uh oh.

I don't think anyone REALLY believed he didn't know. Nobody is that stupid/naive.

I lived in Lawrence for 3 years and there was one incident that was particularly upsetting that never seemed to get out of the city limits. A 16-year-old girl was under the influence of drugs and alcohol and reported being raped by one or two basketball players. Nothing came of it, and everybody in town just pretended not to know anything about it, with some going out of their way to make fun of the minor.

I worked in the service industry at the time and can't name the number of stories we would all hear from our counterparts up and down Mass St about bball players getting away with ****ed up shit.

Sucks that this Gassnola fellow is a moron and got Self caught red handed.

No it isn't

**** the NCAA tho

:shake:

:facepalm:

Did you graduate college and if so, from where?

What did the NCAA do? Enforce their rules? They have to clean up the mess that the NBA and NFL create by their idiotic discriminatory rules. I have no idea how the 19 year old rule is even in place. The NBA knowingly is forcing kids to go to college and to use the NCAA as their free cost to them minor league system.

People shit on the NCAA and I'm tired of it. Nobody is forcing these kids to do anything. They know all the rules before they show up. Don't want to play by the rules? Fine. Do what Mitchell Robinson did - sit out. Or do what lots of kids did - go play in Europe for a year. Stop ****ing whining about the NCAA. The NCAA has to deal with this shit. Let me assure you - the NCAA would love nothing more than to NOT have to deal with these Top 30 kids who are always involved in back alley agent, AAU and shoe company deals. Less work for them to try to investigate stuff.

So this is damning?

Nowhere in the article does it say that Self or KU knew they were paying the kids. None of the texts show that either. Tell me how those texts are "damning". :rolleyes:

Did you read the full article?

Self responded: "I'm happy with Adidas. Just got to get a couple real guys."

Gassnola replied: "In my mind, it's KU, bill self. Everyone else fall into line. Too [expletive] bad. That's what's right for Adidas basketball. And I know I am RIGHT. The more you win, have lottery pics [sic] and you happy. That's how it should work in my mind."

Self responded: "That's how ur works. At UNC and Duke." Gassnola replied at Kentucky as well.

"I promise you I got this," Gassnola wrote. "I have never let you down. Except Dyondre lol. We will get it right."

Maybe he was just telling the players how great KU is and he’s really believable as a third party perspective.

So where did he say he was paying them?

Lock him up

In Haters minds.

Well, he didn't. But there shouldn't be much of a reason the Head Coach of Kansas should be talking to Adidas about recruiting as SPECIFIC player. I hope the NCAA bans apparel contracts. Each schoolnt have have the ability to have a contract of their own - unless they don't want to be in the NCAA.

It doesn't say it, but the public's perception is that it happened.

I did read the full article. I'll say this again, because you seem a little slow. NOWHERE in the article does it talk about paying players. Not one of the texts talks about paying players. They talk about recruiting players. It's not against the rules or improper to recruit them. It's illegal to pay them. Which none of these "damning" texts talk about.

Stopped reading at “he didn’t”.

Yes the public perception is that it happens everywhere, not sure this does anything but confirm that. Shady? yes illegal? no

Yep. It's not like these players, who all know what's permissible and what isn't, have no alternative but to come to the NCAA and try to cheat the system. But there are still plenty of them who are willing to jeopardize their careers and choose a school based on a few easy bucks under the table now.

And there are plenty of boosters and sponsors willing to try to cheat the system to get them there, because the chances of anything major happening are so low.

The coaches being in on the whole thing isn't surprising, they just weren't betting on an FBI investigation and wiretaps and whatall to catch them.

Yeah. I'm sure that's what they were talking about. ROFL

I love the KU haters reading more into this then necessary

Yeah I didn’t see anything that implied he knew about money.

I mean. Yeah. He knows. But I don’t see anything that says he knew.

Yep.

It would be remarkably naive to believe he didn't know. At the same time, there's nothing in those texts that establish to any appreciable degree that he did.

That's a nothingburger.

Laugh all you want, but the texts are right there in black and white. Read them and let me know when you get to the part about paying players. I sure couldn't find it. Not only did I not see that but I did see this:

So...?

In this day and age - you and I both know - you don't have to actually be guilty anymore. You just have to appear possibly guilty. And these text messages are a horrible horrible look and this is very damaging to KU and it's brand.

So you want Self fired over this?

Money is NEVER mentioned. Shoe company reps will get bounced. Unless additional info is uncovered, there's nothing indictable here for KU. Sorry KU haters, not gonna happen.

What is with this use of “ burger”? I saw 40 burger yesterday and it didn’t make sense either.

I get that this stuff goes on. I get every coach should know that this happens. But Self needs to be as far away from this as possible. Have a designated contact outside of the program - have him advise Self personally - NOT OVER A ****ING CELL PHONE and not on text message.

:clap:

Hell, everyone KNOWS, but proving it is entirely different (for now).

For something that clearly goes on at all the other top end College Basketball schools?

Some of the folks who know what Self knew might be facing jail time. Be a shame if any of them rolled.

Exactly

"We aren't the first corrupt program so all corruption should be ignored" doesn't actually fly in the real world.

No, the texts aren't damaging. People are having knee jerk reactions to click bait titles. SELF NEW!!!!! He knew what? That Adidas was trying to help get players to come to KU? Of course they were. They're an Adidas school. I'd be surprised if they didn't try to convince players to go to an Adidas school. There is nothing improper about that.

Adidas PAYING players to go to Adidas schools? Completely different story. And from that article, there is NOTHING showing that Bill Self or Kansas knew about Adidas paying players. There is nothing damning or incriminating in those texts. Of all the texts they have between Self and Gasnola. NONE of them talk about paying players or their families. Gasnola even testified under oath that Self didn't know.

If anything, I think this should help Self rather than hurt him. For months there's been inuendo about this. Now we have their texts and they don't show anything to support the inuendo that Self knew Adidas was paying players, AND Gasnola testified under oath that Self didn't know. Again, the click bait title isn't supported by what's in the article.

You are correct Self didn't text pay the guy but we are talking about Bill Self texting the same guy that was getting\paying players for Pitino asking him if we are good in regards to a player.

Then they had a phone conversation that lasted 5-6 minutes where no one can recall what they talked about it.

He then admitted he paid 2 KU players\families money.

But you are probably right Self had no idea, how naive are you?

Your hate is a known factor here, carry on.

Yeppers. :clap:

Recruiting is shady AF and everyone probably knew...but there's a ton of room for plausible deniability in those texts.

Personally IDGAF, pay players, I don't care. If you're good enough to get paid a ton of money to play basketball or football or xbox or whatever, you should get paid.

Pretty sure he's the doosh who claimed Talib would be an NFL bust, "too slow"

Lollers

He definitely knew, idk how anyone can deny that. But I doubt there will be enough evidence to have anything come from it

Meh. College athletes getting paid some of what they're worth just doesn't really bother me. I do feel bad that Selfs guy got caught so knee deep in shit that his name and text conversations are being brought up in court and used as evidence. That sucks.

You would think after so long not being their rivals they might ease a bit on the hate, nopes. I've forgotten that we ever played them regularly Orange Bowl notwithstanding.

My brother used to be a bouncer at the Cave. Always told me he wanted to beat the Morris' twins asses.

Says the Mizzou fan who still believes Ricky Clemmons was "framed". Raiderfan

Drop the rule that players can't get paid by 3rd parties. That's should be easy enough for the NCAA to do.
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Yes - that is what I would do if I was the NCAA. I'd cap it - and tax it. But the NCAA is free to run their organization the way they see fit IMO.

Why cap it and tax it? If some car dealership wants to give a player 50k, let them. If the player wants to get endorsements and hire an agent/financial manager, let them. Why does the ncaa have to get involved at all?
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Well, because then it won't be fair to mid major teams. Cap it at 100k. 99% of athletes won't get anything anyway - but it would be a huge advantage if it is out in the open for schools if it was unlimited. And tax it because if you don't - it's money laundering.

Sean Miller is still coaching...

Nuff said.

If he gets canned from KU I think he has a good chance at the Nub football job. Can't do any worse than Frost has.

Yep.

He absolutely knew what was going on, just like he kept the Morris boys out of jail more than once.

Man Al Bundy what an insider source you are

How is it not fair for mid majors? Players would still be able to earn money there.

And plus, if it was about fairness we shouldn't allow schools to have hundred million dollar facilities either. All schools should have the same facilities and there should also be a cap on how much coaches earn, etc.

And players would still have to report it as income and get taxed by the government so why should they get taxed by the NCAA also?
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wait the beaks are cheats

is water still wet too?

Exactly.

There's plausible deniability, but, maaaaannn... LMAO It sure doesn't look good.

I think it does look pretty good for KU that Billy never played and that Deandre went to 'Zona, where we know for a fact he got paid $100k.

I'm not saying get taxed by NCAA. Just in general - that is part of the issue here. Taxman not getting their dough.

Kansas has way more wealthy boosters than say - College of Charelston or something.

So stating obvious facts is being a hater? Whether they can actually prove beyond a reasonable doubt is not clear, but it's obvious to anyone who isn't a complete homer that a lot of shady and likely illegal (against NCAA rules) activities have been going on at a number of NCAA schools, including Kansas. You don't have to be a hater to know that Kansas has a long history of breaking the rules and getting away with it.

There's no smoking gun here. Self and the other coaches can still easily maintain plausible deniability. KU will be fine.

But yeah, of course Self knows. All the coaches at this program (and all the programs) know how this game is played and all have no problem reaping the benefits of it. Such is NCAA D1 basketball.

You're either breaking rules or extremely lucky to be that successful for that long.

Damn, that 100K payday might have stopped us from another title. Nike spends the big bucks.

They're all breaking the rules. Hell tiny ass schools break the rules.

It's kinda like them trying to put a square peg in a round hole. They know it will work if they can trim the edges but finally realize they don't have the tools to do it and want to bitch about it.

"I love to coach basketball but uh but uh, it's time to restore the orrrrder"

I think anyone that follows the sport should be aware that this is how it works. And that's everywhere. High level players have a price. Coaches like Self can avoid any direct negotiations and allow the shoe reps to handle the dirty work. Only desperate idiots like Sean Miller or small-timers facilitate anything themselves.

I'm sure some of these coaches don't approve of this. But the alternative is watching Kentucky and Duke get every high profile recruit (which they basically do anyway). Then termination for not keeping up. Catch-22.

What cracks me up are the holier than thou moron fans of schools like Kentucky who actually believe their players aren't paid.

That limb your standing on is about to break, might want to head for something more sturdy.

I don't really follow basketball and I don't even remember what he got in trouble for, but I'm certain I never proclaimed his innocence.

Death Penalty.

Why does college basketball have to be this way? School pride? The spirit of competition? Profit? We already have a pro league and a dev league.

it is kind of like hearing KU homers saying "so, what is the big deal?"