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Mr. Laz 05-03-2012 10:35 AM

Elder Scrolls MMO Announced
 
Elder Scrolls Online Announced
Leave a Comment
Posted 13 minutes ago - By Stephen Johnson

The Elder Scrolls Online has been announced by Bethesda. It is being developed for PC and Mac under the leadership of Matt Firor, who has spent the last two decades working in online game development.

“We have been working hard to create an online world in which players will be able to experience the epic Elder Scrolls universe with their friends, something fans have long said they wanted,” said Matt Firor, game director of The Elder Scrolls Online. “It will be extremely rewarding finally to unveil what we have been developing the last several years. The entire team is committed to creating the best MMO ever made – and one that is worthy of The Elder Scrolls franchise.”

Details are scant at this time, but expect a screenshot later today and a teaser trailer tomorrow.

Sofa King 05-03-2012 10:38 AM

This could be fun.

SuperChief 05-03-2012 10:52 AM

I really hope they do this right. I'm a big fan of the franchise, but they could royally **** this one up. I hope not.

kaplin42 05-03-2012 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuperChief (Post 8591464)
I really hope they do this right. I'm a big fan of the franchise, but they could royally **** this one up. I hope not.

As epic as skyrim was, it was also buggy as hell. They better clean that kind of nonesense up quite a bit if they want to be even remotely successful.

That being said, ****ing giggity giggity, I'm in.

Frazod 05-03-2012 11:05 AM

****. I assume this means that every future Elder Scrolls game will be a goddamn MMO now. 4321

QuikSsurfer 05-03-2012 11:46 AM

I'm interested.

Pants 05-03-2012 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by QuikSsurfer (Post 8591609)
I'm interested.

Same here, but I'm worried too. Bethesda can't make a balanced SP game to save their lives, not sure how they plan on creating a balanced MP experience (which is a million times more difficult). I won't even mention the bugs, lol.

QuikSsurfer 05-03-2012 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pants (Post 8591781)
Same here, but I'm worried too. Bethesda can't make a balanced SP game to save their lives, not sure how they plan on creating a balanced MP experience (which is a million times more difficult). I won't even mention the bugs, lol.

Heh, this is all very true.

Bump 05-03-2012 12:51 PM

count me in

QuikSsurfer 05-03-2012 12:57 PM

Elder Scrolls games at launch:

http://cdn.userpics.com/original/ritsa.gif

pr_capone 05-03-2012 01:26 PM

OUT.

After years of playing their games, Skyrim soured me on bethseda. I'll stick with Guild Wars 2 thank you very much.

drunkie 05-03-2012 01:26 PM

this company is known for making great games. they own id software the makers of doom am quake so they have the help to build online games. the problem is that while they make great games they are also known for making very buggy games. every game they have made have been filled with bugs. in single player you can deal with bugs a lil better but in a mmo setting you need a game that is very polished else it creates a huge mess. sadly i think this will end up a mess because of there bugs. this company is not good at weeding out the bugs well enough to make a solid mmo

Bump 05-03-2012 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drunkie (Post 8591893)
this company is known for making great games. they own id software the makers of doom am quake so they have the help to build online games. the problem is that while they make great games they are also known for making very buggy games. every game they have made have been filled with bugs. in single player you can deal with bugs a lil better but in a mmo setting you need a game that is very polished else it creates a huge mess. sadly i think this will end up a mess because of there bugs. this company is not good at weeding out the bugs well enough to make a solid mmo

maybe they are aware of that and intend to polish the bugs, or maybe not...

Pants 05-03-2012 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pr_capone (Post 8591891)
OUT.

After years of playing their games, Skyrim soured me on bethseda. I'll stick with Guild Wars 2 thank you very much.

I watched some videos from the GW2 beta and it looked pretty cool. I wasn't a big fan of the oversimplified (almost Diablo-like) combat though.

ToxSocks 05-03-2012 02:30 PM

Oh yay. I get to hear more people harass me about how "X" game is the new WoW Killer.

Silock 05-03-2012 03:24 PM

Lame.

whoman69 05-03-2012 03:26 PM

Problem with this is modders are the ones that fix most of their glitches. You can't mod an MMO.

kcxiv 05-03-2012 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Detoxing (Post 8592031)
Oh yay. I get to hear more people harass me about how "X" game is the new WoW Killer.

The good thing is it doesnt have to be a WOW killer. It just has to be good enough to retain people and make a profit.

Anyways, i like how they are going with the EQ style hotbars. You can only have a certain ammount of abilities to use. Not like games now days where you have 6 bars of abilities open.

3 factions for PVP should be freaking interesting lol

QuikSsurfer 05-03-2012 09:30 PM

Game Informer info

Quote:

-Releasing 2013 for PC/Mac
-Developed by ZeniMax Online Studios
-MMORPG
-250 Person Team
-Started development in 2007
-"This time, saving the world from the awakening of ancient evil is only the beginning. What happens when hundreds or thousands of prophesied heroes all think that they should be Emperor?"
-The game is fully voice acted
-Third person perspective
-The game uses a hotbar to activate skills like other traditional MMOs
-Visually it looks like other Hero Engine MMOs like SWTOR
-The general art style is kind of like RIFT or Everquest 2
-You can't be a werewolf or vampire
-Crafting, alchemy, and soul stones will exist in an unrevealed form
-There will be Daedric Princes like Molag Bal, the primary antagonist, and Vaermina, "whose sphere of influence extends to the dream world and the nightmares of mortals", along with some unnamed others
-Constellations will be in the game a la Mundus stones (which work like guardian stones) and also give the answer to things like block puzzles where you step on the blocks in a certain order
-Tons of towns ranging from Imperial City, Windhelm, Daggerfall, Sentinel, Mournhold, Ebonheart, Elden Root, Shornhelm, Evermore, Riften, and a lot more
-Radiant AI will not be present
-There will be mounts, but no flying mounts
-Fast travel exists in the game in the form of wayshrines, which are also your ressurection point, and you can teleport from one wayshrine to any other wayshrine you have already visited
-There most likely won't be dragons
-Sneaking will be in the game, but how it is implemented is undecided
-They're not talking about pets right now
-There will be no player housing
-There will be no NPC romances or marriage
-"It needs to be comfortable for people who are coming in from a typical massively multiplayer game that has the same control mechanisms, but it also has to appeal to Skyrim players."
-Features most of Tamriel including Skyrim, Morrowind, Summerset Isle, and Elseweyr.
-"Not all provinces are included in their entirety; Zenimax Online is keeping large areas inaccessible to save them for use as expansion content. Nonetheless, every major area is represented to some extent."
-As an example, Windhelm is fully implemented, but Winterhold and the mages' college won't be in at launch.
-There are three player factions:
--Ebonheart Pact: The Nords, Dunmer, and Argoninans
--Aldmeri Dominion: Altmer, Bosmer, and Khajit
--Daggerfall Covenant: Bretons, Redguard, and Orcs
-"Recreateing the freedom Elder Scrolls players expect within the World of Warcraft-style mechanics Zenimax Online is using for this MMO would be impossible without changing the way that players interact with the world."
-As such, the game uses a hubless design
-For example, you don't necessarily pick up a quest to do the following, but if you kill all the necromancers in an undead barrow, a shade you free at the end will reward you.
-However, to help you find these events, various NPCs you talk to will tell you where they are happening and put a marker pointing them on your map, which is obviously totally different than receiving a quest.
-Not all quests will have NPCs that indicate where they are
-The game uses MMORPG genre standards such as classes, experience points, and other traditional MMORPG progression mechanics, but they try to present it "around the core fantasy presented by traditiona Elder Scrolls games" such as traveling around and righting wrongs or seeking riches
-The game world is very large relative to Skyrim
-You can explore almost anything you can see
-the game is set 1000 years in the past
-You can't master every discipline
-The imperials are an enemy to all three factions, lead by the noble Tharn family and the King of Worms, Mannimarco, and are hatching a plot to take over all of Tamriel
-But BEHOLD, Mannicmarco is scheming with Daedric prince Molag Bal to take over the world behind the Tharn's back
-Also, your soul has already been stolen by Molag Bal, which is the reason you can come back from death over and over again, and the starting plot is that you're fighting Molag Bal to get your soul back from him
-Hitting the level cap takes about 120 hours
-Each faction has their own leveling content
-An example quest is the story of Camlorn, where you have to stop evil werewolves who have their eyes set on conquest. First, you have to do a "standard MMO kill and collection quest" to sto ghosts from attacking some mages and soldiers. The ghosts are reliving a battle that the werewolf leader was in. You summon a ghost to find out what's going on, and the ghost tells you to wear her dead husband's armor to re-experience the battle he died in. You then get transported hundreds of years into the past to fight this battle. During this battle, you can choose to save the dead man's wife or to pursue the Werewolf leader. ZeniMax chooses to save the man's wife, who then tells you that the Werewolf leader is weak to fire. This information is helpful when you fight him, but you don't actually need to do this quest before fighting the werewolf leader if you don't want to. Basically, you can skip parts of quest chains if you want, but you get some benefit for playing the whole thing. Also, whenever you go back to the town you just saved, everything there hails you as a hero.
-The game features three faction PvP where you fight to take over keeps and use trebuchets and other siege weapons to help do it. At the high end, you can have 100 v 100 battles. There are also farms and mines you can try to take over. Mots of this happens in Cyrodiil where your goal is to take over and hold the Imperial City to get faction wide bonuses for it. If you have played Dark Age of Camelot, this probably sounds familiar. For those who haven't, essentially the entire zone is a giant PvP area will all sorts of points of interest.
-The most accomplished PvP player on your faction becomes emperor whenever you take over the capital
-When you take over Cyrodiil, you will be able to adventure in it as a hostile city a la Kvatch
-The game will have raids and heroic modes for its dungeons as end game content in addition to faction PvP
-There is also balanced PvP for people who prefer eSports
-The game will also have high end public dungeons
-Public dungeons are essentially instances that aren't actually instanced, so anyone can be in them, so imagine a World of Warcraft dungeon that featured everyone on the server in the area instead of just your party
-There are standard instanced dungeons as well
-Back on the topic of the skillbar, you have a limited number of skills you can use at any given time, and can change them whenever you're out of combat
-The number of skills is equal to (paraphrase) "a light and heavy attack with your current weapon that take up the first two slots, a few more spells related to your class, and an ultimate in the last slot".
-The ultimate is used once you gain enough finesse, which is earned by doing well in combat
-You also get a bonus loot chest if you're soloing and max your finesse, and you can also build finesse by comboing with other players
-For example, a rogue can put oil on the ground that a mage can set on fire
-A fighter can also spin in the firestorm a mage puts down, which sends out fireballs
-If you've seen Guild Wars 2 videos, the above will seem familiar
-You can't combo with the abilities of enemy players though, so if an enemy faction player drops an oil slick, you can't set it on fire
-The Thieves Guild and Dark Brotherhood will be presented, but in what form isn't detailed as their contnet is hard to recreate in an MMO setting
-NPCs will try to work together and use player like behavior when fighting you, and (at least to my understanding) have stamina as well
-They want the AI to be good, so instead of enemies in a dungeon sitting around and waiting to be pulled, you will be attacked by the entire room and they will try to react to how you are playing
-The claim was not demo'ed to Game Informer
-You destroy dark anchors to gain reputation with the Fighter's Guild. They are large hooks that fall from the sky pseudorandomly and have Daedric guardians next to them. They are easier to kill with a group, and once destroyed, everyone who participated gets a reputation boost with the Fighter's Guild, and eventually nets you rewards like new skills and abilities.
-The combat model will not be real time due to latency
-The combat is based around a stamina bar which you can use to sprint, block, interrupt, and break incapacitating effects
-Blocking is the primary focus of these abilities, and can do things like stopping the secondary effects of attacks such as an ice spell slowing you
-Stamina also applies to PvP, so stamina management (and wearing down your enemy's stamina) is important, as your crowd control abilities might be on a long cooldown, and if you use them before the enemy player runs out of stamina, they will probably just block the effect
-ZeniMax feels that having the stamina bar will help break down the Holy Trinity as stamina allows you to do things like tank
-However, healing is still a big part of the game
-There is also no aggro mechanic in the game, which is part of the reason stamina blocking and healing exist

Bump 05-03-2012 09:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Detoxing (Post 8592031)
Oh yay. I get to hear more people harass me about how "X" game is the new WoW Killer.

damn, they're still looking for a wow killer?

Imon Yourside 05-03-2012 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frazod (Post 8591494)
****. I assume this means that every future Elder Scrolls game will be a goddamn MMO now. 4321

My feeling exactly, I much prefer the single player version.

Bump 05-03-2012 11:48 PM

I just hope they get more than 3 or 4 voice actors for the whole game

Silock 05-04-2012 01:43 AM

I was gonna play this game, until I took an arrow to the knee.

htismaqe 05-04-2012 07:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pr_capone (Post 8591891)
OUT.

After years of playing their games, Skyrim soured me on bethseda. I'll stick with Guild Wars 2 thank you very much.

It took until Skyrim?

You obviously never played Battlespire - oh wait, I never played it as a new release either because Bethesda "lost" my pre-order...

kaplin42 05-04-2012 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by QuikSsurfer (Post 8593172)
Game Informer info

Based on the long list of info that I'm omitting from this quote, this game looks like another generic MMO, plus a block feature a la Tera.

Taking odds that this will be the buggiest MMO ever.

If they could have kept the fighting, and interaction with NPC's like Skyrim, it would have been win. But it sounds like their just another theme park pretending to be a sandbox.

In any event, it still may be worth trying out, depending on how bad TOR is by then.

Bump 05-04-2012 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by htismaqe (Post 8593705)
It took until Skyrim?

You obviously never played Battlespire - oh wait, I never played it as a new release either because Bethesda "lost" my pre-order...

I guess I don't understand your hatred towards Bethesda. Why are you so sour towards them? I've enjoyed all the games I've played by them, but they are only Oblivion, Fallout 3 and Skyrim.

Pants 05-04-2012 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bump (Post 8594114)
I guess I don't understand your hatred towards Bethesda. Why are you so sour towards them? I've enjoyed all the games I've played by them, but they are only Oblivion, Fallout 3 and Skyrim.

Their games are enjoyable but they're buggy as shit and completely imbalanced.

htismaqe 05-04-2012 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bump (Post 8594114)
I guess I don't understand your hatred towards Bethesda. Why are you so sour towards them? I've enjoyed all the games I've played by them, but they are only Oblivion, Fallout 3 and Skyrim.

I started with Elder Scrolls Arena.

Daggerfall was one of the buggiest games in the history of PC gaming. Even though I never was able to finish Daggerfall due to the bugs, I stuck with them and pre-ordered Battlespire.

I never did receive that pre-order and their customer service ranged from "I know nothing" to "I am going to transfer you to my manager (click)" to "we don't have any record that you pre-ordered anything from us".

Imon Yourside 05-04-2012 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pants (Post 8594146)
Their games are enjoyable but they're buggy as shit and completely imbalanced.

That's half the charm, and you have to remember they go places most developers only dream of.

Imon Yourside 05-04-2012 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by htismaqe (Post 8594171)
I started with Elder Scrolls Arena.

Daggerfall was one of the buggiest games in the history of PC gaming. Even though I never was able to finish Daggerfall due to the bugs, I stuck with them and pre-ordered Battlespire.

I never did receive that pre-order and their customer service ranged from "I know nothing" to "I am going to transfer you to my manager (click)" to "we don't have any record that you pre-ordered anything from us".

You must be as old as me, and I loved Daggerfall despite having 300+ hours invested in a character only to get stuck on the stairwell forever in my own house...lolz. Arena was fun as well. Battlespire was just pure fail all the way around, the game sucked ass. It was billed as more of an action game to compete with..i believe ....was it die by the sword?

<iframe width="640" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/I-lvqEs7aJ0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

ToxSocks 05-04-2012 01:31 PM

I like the idea of stealing DAoC's PvP System. Their PvP system was soooo much fun.

ChiefFripp 05-04-2012 01:33 PM

Hopefully they have more than 5 people doing the character voices.

R.I.P. MCA.

Frazod 05-04-2012 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiefFripp (Post 8594392)
Hopefully they have more than 5 people doing the character voices.

R.I.P. MCA.

Or get people who can at least change up accents, speaking styles, etc. How hard can it be, especially if you're reading prepared material? :shake:

Valiant 05-04-2012 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kaplin42 (Post 8591475)
As epic as skyrim was, it was also buggy as hell. They better clean that kind of nonesense up quite a bit if they want to be even remotely successful.

That being said, ****ing giggity giggity, I'm in.

Uhh that is how mmo's are. Buggy as **** when released. The crowd is used to it. They could be 10x buggier then skyrim and it is fine the procedures.

Valiant 05-04-2012 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by QuikSsurfer (Post 8593172)
Game Informer info

If they can recreate daoc, then awesome. But they will have to leave it somewhat difficult.

kaplin42 05-04-2012 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Valiant (Post 8594428)
Uhh that is how mmo's are. Buggy as **** when released. The crowd is used to it. They could be 10x buggier then skyrim and it is fine the procedures.

Rift was not, in fact buggy as hell. Class balancing issues sure, but not buggy as hell.

TOR on the other hand, OMFG, it's just terrible.

I've been playing MMO's for over 10 years, I know what the genre is like. I also know that a single player game is a lot easier to design than an MMO. And Bethsada can't even put out one of those that is within the accpetable realm of buggyness, I honestly fear their MMO will be nye unplayble due to the bugs.

jspchief 05-04-2012 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Detoxing (Post 8592031)
Oh yay. I get to hear more people harass me about how "X" game is the new WoW Killer.

There will never be a single "wow killer".

WoW will die a death by a thousand cuts, most of them self inflicted.

drunkie 05-04-2012 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jspchief (Post 8594992)
There will never be a single "wow killer".

WoW will die a death by a thousand cuts, most of them self inflicted.


if wow doesn't kill itself off with the easy mode crap there will be a wow killer. it is code named titan. the company has such a blind following that there next mmo will break records. an for anyone that doesn't know that company is blizzard. titan is there next mmo being worked on

Quesadilla Joe 08-23-2013 12:14 PM

Quote:

Bethesda confirms business model for upcoming fantasy MMO game; monthly subscription will cost $14.99/€12.99/£8.99.
http://www.gamespot.com/gamescom/eld...n-fee-6413369/

jd1020 08-23-2013 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drunkie (Post 8595066)
if wow doesn't kill itself off with the easy mode crap there will be a wow killer. it is code named titan. the company has such a blind following that there next mmo will break records. an for anyone that doesn't know that company is blizzard. titan is there next mmo being worked on

Every hyped MMO coming out reaches like 1-2M subs and then dies off. I wouldn't be surprised if Titan follows the same fate, especially after seeing the recent offerings from Blizzard. People wont play a game that sucks no matter who puts the stamp on the front. Hell... even Blizzard thought Titan sucked and scrapped it to start over. It must have been pretty ****ing awful for them to do that while releasing D3.

hometeam 08-23-2013 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd1020 (Post 9908624)
Every hyped MMO coming out reaches like 1-2M subs and then dies off. I wouldn't be surprised if Titan follows the same fate, especially after seeing the recent offerings from Blizzard. People wont play a game that sucks no matter who puts the stamp on the front. Hell... even Blizzard thought Titan sucked and scrapped it to start over. It must have been pretty ****ing awful for them to do that while releasing D3.

Guildwars 2 is still kicking extremely strong, after Chinese launch I expect it to dethrone WoW with concurrent players.

Of course, GW2 has no subscription fee, and MMO developers that are not taking notice of this are doing themselves a disservice.

Pants 08-23-2013 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hometeam (Post 9908962)
Guildwars 2 is still kicking extremely strong, after Chinese launch I expect it to dethrone WoW with concurrent players.

Of course, GW2 has no subscription fee, and MMO developers that are not taking notice of this are doing themselves a disservice.

I'd rather pay $15/mo for something as amazing as Ahn'Qiraj-age WoW.

Setsuna 08-23-2013 10:01 PM

If anyone is interested in this game, then watch the videos of Shoddy Cast. Those guys are diehard Elder Scrolls fans and exclusively have videos about ESO development and content.

Imon Yourside 08-26-2013 12:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hometeam (Post 9908962)
Guildwars 2 is still kicking extremely strong, after Chinese launch I expect it to dethrone WoW with concurrent players.

Of course, GW2 has no subscription fee, and MMO developers that are not taking notice of this are doing themselves a disservice.

I love the GW2 model but the game kinda blows. Free to play is the wave of the future, I mean Warframe has better graphics/gameplay/reward system and you don't have to spend a dime.

MTG#10 09-07-2013 04:27 PM

Got to play this for a couple hours yesterday for a beta stress test. Still needs some touching up but it was ****ing great. Still don't think Im going to buy it though, I cant get myself to pay $60 for a game then have to pay $15/month just to play the damn thing.

Sandy Vagina 09-07-2013 04:31 PM

Not a fan of MMOs anyway, but I will get this one and enjoy the single player. I played so many hours of Morrowind, Oblivion, and Skyrim. I expect this one to be as or more amazing and deep. PBJ

Bump 09-10-2013 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTG#10 (Post 9947782)
Got to play this for a couple hours yesterday for a beta stress test. Still needs some touching up but it was ****ing great. Still don't think Im going to buy it though, I cant get myself to pay $60 for a game then have to pay $15/month just to play the damn thing.

$60 for game
$15/mo
Plus a cash shop


sorry, but triple dipping breaks the chip.

kaplin42 09-11-2013 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bump (Post 9961178)
$60 for game
$15/mo
Plus a cash shop


sorry, but triple dipping breaks the chip.

Meh, the price of the game, plus the monthly fee is MMO standard. The cash shop is what gets me. As long as it doesn't offer any real benefit, i.e. NOT "pay to win" but offers fluff stuff like different mount models that don't exceed the speed of your current fastest mount, then I don't really care. It provides variety and people will buy that stuff up like crazy letting the company earn extra money.

When the cash shop = "pay to win" then I'm all out. Takes the fun right out of the game.

Imon Yourside 09-11-2013 10:53 AM

Why would I pay full price of the game plus $15/month? Never seen a reason to do that and this won't suck me in either.

Mr. Laz 09-11-2013 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bump (Post 9961178)
$60 for game
$15/mo
Plus a cash shop

sorry, but triple dipping breaks the chip.

Quote:

Originally Posted by KILLER_CLOWN (Post 9962796)
Why would I pay full price of the game plus $15/month? Never seen a reason to do that and this won't suck me in either.

you should be happy and glad to pay extra for a good game /Pants /Kegs

kaplin42 09-11-2013 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KILLER_CLOWN (Post 9962796)
Why would I pay full price of the game plus $15/month? Never seen a reason to do that and this won't suck me in either.

Not that I'm going to convince you otherwise, but try to think of it this way. An MMO is not like other video games. It never, ever ends, there is always something new to do, levels to achieve, items to earn or craft. MMO's are the ultimate pellet maze, getting one pellet, makes you want to run the maze to get more and more.

Unlike games like say Madden where the main game is released, and then there is a few patches, and maybe some DLC (Which you pay for), MMO's are never that finite, and they are an amazing, if not all consuming form of entertainment. There is always someone patching, updating and adding new content.

How much do you pay for cable or satellite? $60 - $150 depending on the channels you get and what not? But let's take the low end of that $60 a month. That $2.00 a day for unlimited entertainment. An MMO is $15 a month or $.50 and day for unlimited entertainment that is engaging, challenging and social, as opposed to staring blankly at a box.

keg in kc 09-11-2013 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Laz (Post 9962932)
you should be happy and glad to pay extra for a good game /Pants /Kegs

What?

loochy 09-11-2013 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bump (Post 9961178)
$60 for game
$15/mo
Plus a cash shop


sorry, but triple dipping breaks the chip.

hey man! long time no see!

Imon Yourside 09-11-2013 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kaplin42 (Post 9963208)
Not that I'm going to convince you otherwise, but try to think of it this way. An MMO is not like other video games. It never, ever ends, there is always something new to do, levels to achieve, items to earn or craft. MMO's are the ultimate pellet maze, getting one pellet, makes you want to run the maze to get more and more.

Unlike games like say Madden where the main game is released, and then there is a few patches, and maybe some DLC (Which you pay for), MMO's are never that finite, and they are an amazing, if not all consuming form of entertainment. There is always someone patching, updating and adding new content.

How much do you pay for cable or satellite? $60 - $150 depending on the channels you get and what not? But let's take the low end of that $60 a month. That $2.00 a day for unlimited entertainment. An MMO is $15 a month or $.50 and day for unlimited entertainment that is engaging, challenging and social, as opposed to staring blankly at a box.

I get what you're saying I really do, i'm playing Warframe right now and it does all that better than any other game i've played including WOW on private servers and guess what it is COMPLETELY FREE.

Pants 09-11-2013 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Laz (Post 9962932)
you should be happy and glad to pay extra for a good game /Pants /Kegs

For the amount of entertainment one can get from a good MMO, $15/month is pretty much free.

I pay that much money to go see a 2 hour movie in IMAX 3D. I can very easily justify paying $15 for 100 hours of solid entertainment. That's what, 15 cents an hour? Ya, like I said... free.

whoman69 09-12-2013 07:21 AM

I'm with the anti paying more crowd. Just because it never ends does not mean you won't get bored with it just as quickly. Additionally after I'm bored with a game I will usually come back to it later. You do that with an MMO you have to start from square one.

kaplin42 09-12-2013 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KILLER_CLOWN (Post 9963377)
I get what you're saying I really do, i'm playing Warframe right now and it does all that better than any other game i've played including WOW on private servers and guess what it is COMPLETELY FREE.

You're right there are tons of MMO's, and I personally believe almost all new MMO's will have some sort of F2P model. I personally don't really like that model, but to each their own.

The reason F2P even exists is because it makes the companies more money that the subscription model. What one could get by being a "Gold" member at $15/mo you can get spend over ten times that a month for in a F2P model. It just doesn't look like it, but $5 here, $3 there, another $10 to have access to that class/itme/area and you're already over the $15/mo rate.

Granted you can play for free and not even ever pay for anything, but you miss a lot of the game that way.

hometeam 09-12-2013 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kaplin42 (Post 9965457)
You're right there are tons of MMO's, and I personally believe almost all new MMO's will have some sort of F2P model. I personally don't really like that model, but to each their own.

The reason F2P even exists is because it makes the companies more money that the subscription model. What one could get by being a "Gold" member at $15/mo you can get spend over ten times that a month for in a F2P model. It just doesn't look like it, but $5 here, $3 there, another $10 to have access to that class/itme/area and you're already over the $15/mo rate.

Granted you can play for free and not even ever pay for anything, but you miss a lot of the game that way.


Serious MMO's will not have pay to win systems. Pay for aesthetics maybe, pay for a faster leveling experience yes. Pay to win? Not serious MMO's.

See Guild Wars 2.

kaplin42 11-20-2013 01:19 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Look what I got today.

hometeam 11-20-2013 01:41 PM

Yea, have been seeing it pop up on reddit.

What kind of sucks is there there is no application process, just an email sign up.

So any random dude can get in with any hardware.

I have lots of beta test experience and nasty high end hardware. LEMME PLAY :'(

hometeam 11-20-2013 01:43 PM

If anyone gets in that isn't interested I will trade a beta key for a copy of torchlight 2, just cause 2, or a smattering of left over humble bundle cd keys. pm me!

kaplin42 11-20-2013 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hometeam (Post 10207455)
Yea, have been seeing it pop up on reddit.

What kind of sucks is there there is no application process, just an email sign up.

So any random dude can get in with any hardware.

I have lots of beta test experience and nasty high end hardware. LEMME PLAY :'(

Im in the same boat though. Been playing MMO's forever, I have beta tested at least 3 of them, and I have high end system as well.

My problem is that this will just be a carbon copy of WoW with better graphics, but extremely dumbed down for the masses.

hometeam 11-20-2013 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kaplin42 (Post 10207490)
Im in the same boat though. Been playing MMO's forever, I have beta tested at least 3 of them, and I have high end system as well.

My problem is that this will just be a carbon copy of WoW with better graphics, but extremely dumbed down for the masses.

I have been keeping up with it a little bit. Seems like its going to be more like guildwars 2 than wow, and gw2 is a very good game.

Im not saying TESO is going to be great. It might suck.

I still want to try it~

Pants 11-20-2013 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kaplin42 (Post 10207490)
Im in the same boat though. Been playing MMO's forever, I have beta tested at least 3 of them, and I have high end system as well.

My problem is that this will just be a carbon copy of WoW with better graphics, but extremely dumbed down for the masses.

The fact that there are 3 factions is already going to be a massive improvement over WoW at least in terms of PvP, IMO. But then again, I haven't played WoW since like 2008 or something, so I don't even know how much the game has changed since.

Also, I'm not sure what any one MMO can do to really be different from WoW or even any other MMO. The genre is what it is, there's not that much a developer can do to be drastically different (kind of like FPS games). After all, if you change the formula too much, you're running the risk of destroying the very thing that usually keeps people coming back.

kaplin42 11-20-2013 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pants (Post 10207584)
The fact that there are 3 factions is already going to be a massive improvement over WoW at least in terms of PvP, IMO. But then again, I haven't played WoW since like 2008 or something, so I don't even know how much the game has changed since.

Also, I'm not sure what any one MMO can do to really be different from WoW or even any other MMO. The genre is what it is, there's not that much a developer can do to be drastically different (kind of like FPS games). After all, if you change the formula too much, you're running the risk of destroying the very thing that usually keeps people coming back.

Actually I could think of a lot of things that could be done to improve MMO's. Some of it is basic common sense at this point. Any new start up should look back at the last 15 years of MMOing and get a clear idea of what to do.

I'm not saying that they have to change the formula, but some of the features could be improved upon by leaps and bounds.

1.st thing. Stop dumbing down the content. I know this would eliminate all the WoW babies, but so what, some of us liked having a challenge.

QuikSsurfer 11-20-2013 04:20 PM

Beta... I'm in.

jd1020 11-20-2013 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kaplin42 (Post 10207618)
1.st thing. Stop dumbing down the content. I know this would eliminate all the WoW babies, but so what, some of us liked having a challenge.

I'd like to play a MMO that doesn't havent instant travel. Everything is instanced these days. What ever happened to exploring? That's the whole point of "massive."

I used to spend entire nights just wall walking around WoW getting into places you weren't suppose to have access to. Then they added flying mounts in the 1st expansion. Pretty much killed exploration but you couldnt use them in pre-expansion content, so cool. Then they made it so you could use them in the original content... **** you! Then they simply just made it to where you open up a menu and queue up and when your queue pops... BAM! Instantly there and when its over you are right back to where you were when the queue popped... DIE IN A FIRE!

hometeam 11-20-2013 04:51 PM

Damn you beta bastards. Let me innnnn

kaplin42 11-20-2013 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd1020 (Post 10207838)
I'd like to play a MMO that doesn't havent instant travel. Everything is instanced these days. What ever happened to exploring? That's the whole point of "massive."

I agree, as with everything though, it's a fine line. I don't want to sit on a boat for 40 minutes like in EQ1, but I agree with getting rid of instant travel removal so you actually had to make your way to different destinations.

Some quick blurbs about other things I would do:
Tl;dr lots of ideas to fix some features in MMO’s.
Spoiler!

Hammock Parties 11-20-2013 05:51 PM

signed up for beta

http://replygif.net/i/237.gif

Pants 11-20-2013 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kaplin42 (Post 10207910)
How to solve the appearance armor issue; Change the way weapons and armor are effective. Instead of having stats on the items, the items have slots, the better the item, the more slots. These slots can be segregated a little bit, for example resistance in some, bonus to hit/crit in others, and then base stat improvement. To fill these slots you need gems or what not, the better the gem, the better the stat improvement. Customize the look you want, with the stats you need. Gems can be assigned to clothing locations, helmet, feet, arm so that you can’t just find the best gem dropping mob in the game and farm it.

Speaking of stats; for ****s sake have the right stats mean something to the right class. I have in two games been told that either strength or dexterity is the stat for my class that will improve everything; instead it has been the opposite in each game. So when you build your armor, you build the wrong stats, and then realize you messed up and now have to obtain different gear. It's called math, hire someone to figure it out for you before you code it in.

Balancing PVE vs PVP; I am so sick of having raiders come into PVP contests with their raid gear and be so much better than the top geared PVP players, and vice versa. Neither one should affect the other. If it says PVP in it, it will be almost useless in a PVE environment, if it doesn't say PVP on it; it will be pointless in a PVP environment. Spells and abilities should have two versions, PVE and PVP. Stop nerfing PVE spells because they are too powerful in PVP. I can't believe over the last 10 years that how to solve this issue hasn't been figured out yet.

SW:TOR did both of these things really well. Towards the end, PvE gear was completely useless in PvP. It was ridiculous. I think there definitely has to be some kind of balance for those who prefer one or the other, but you can't just make PvE gear completely useless in PvP because it ruins open world PvP. Maybe you can have arena sets that can only be used in organized PvP... IDK.

Balancing MMOs is definitely not the easiest thing to do.

jd1020 11-20-2013 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pants (Post 10208007)
SW:TOR did both of these things really well. Towards the end, PvE gear was completely useless in PvP. It was ridiculous. I think there definitely has to be some kind of balance for those who prefer one or the other, but you can't just make PvE gear completely useless in PvP because it ruins open world PvP. Maybe you can have arena sets that can only be used in organized PvP... IDK.

Balancing MMOs is definitely not the easiest thing to do.

I've never understood why there needs to be separate gear for PVP.

I never had a problem with getting wiped clean by someone who spent the time to get the legendaries in WoW, that's the nature of the beast. I didn't want to spend 8 hours a night 7 days a week farming all the shit needed to run the hardest raids in the game so I accepted that fact.

Now they are switching it to where you only need to play 10 arenas or w/e a week and get the latest and greatest PVP items which will mop the floor with anyone wielding items that probably took 6+ months to get? Come on...

Pants 11-20-2013 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd1020 (Post 10208012)
I've never understood why there needs to be separate gear for PVP.

I never had a problem with getting wiped clean by someone who spent the time to get the legendaries in WoW, that's the nature of the beast. I didn't want to spend 8 hours a night 7 days a week farming all the shit needed to run the hardest raids in the game so I excepted that fact.

Now they are switching it to where you only need to play 10 arenas or w/e a week and get the latest and greatest PVP items which will mop the floor with anyone wielding items that probably took 6+ months to get? Come on...

I get both philosophies. On one hand, you want PvP to be based on skill and not gear. On the other hand, you want the rewards you work so hard for to actually provide a tangible benefit.

I honestly don't know which one I would prefer, they both make sense to me.

MTG#10 11-21-2013 10:48 AM

I got this too. I participated in the first beta test a few months ago and it was great then, can't wait to see the progress.

kaplin42 11-21-2013 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pants (Post 10208563)
I get both philosophies. On one hand, you want PvP to be based on skill and not gear. On the other hand, you want the rewards you work so hard for to actually provide a tangible benefit.

I honestly don't know which one I would prefer, they both make sense to me.

I don't see why you can't have both. Taking the gem slot vision of the gear, why not have two sets of slots for stats, PVE and PVP. When PVP flag is on, the PVP gems apply, when it is off, the PVE stats apply. Yes it's twice the work to get the PVP and PVE stats up for the armor, but that is only if you do both, and not everyone does.

You would get the various gems like you would anything else. Raids, dungeons, quests provide nice gems for PVE. and then PVP battlegrounds/arenas provide nice gems for PVP. You could even extend this to crafting so you wouldn't have to have crafting gear, but you could have gem slots for that.

The organization of this could be easily be done through tabs on your paper doll. And by doing it this way, you can always keep the armor/look that you like, but advance in stats by upgrading the gems.

Pants 11-21-2013 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kaplin42 (Post 10209325)
I don't see why you can't have both. Taking the gem slot vision of the gear, why not have two sets of slots for stats, PVE and PVP. When PVP flag is on, the PVP gems apply, when it is off, the PVE stats apply. Yes it's twice the work to get the PVP and PVE stats up for the armor, but that is only if you do both, and not everyone does.

You would get the various gems like you would anything else. Raids, dungeons, quests provide nice gems for PVE. and then PVP battlegrounds/arenas provide nice gems for PVP. You could even extend this to crafting so you wouldn't have to have crafting gear, but you could have gem slots for that.

The organization of this could be easily be done through tabs on your paper doll. And by doing it this way, you can always keep the armor/look that you like, but advance in stats by upgrading the gems.

That's exactly how SWTOR was doing it. You had two different sets for PvP and PvE. The only thing is that there were people who did way more PvP than other people and were able to steamroll those who played less due to the gear difference. There is no easy fix for this, I don't think.

kaplin42 11-21-2013 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pants (Post 10209340)
That's exactly how SWTOR was doing it. You had two different sets for PvP and PvE. The only thing is that there were people who did way more PvP than other people and were able to steamroll those who played less due to the gear difference. There is no easy fix for this, I don't think.

Not a new idea, but ranked combat according to gear. Similar ideas are being done already. It just needs to be fine tuned a bit. Would be similar to how you have to do easy mode, then normal, then hard mode dungeons. Also, unlike Rift, don't put newly level 50 characters right into the shit storm. They just hit 50, and probably don't have the gear, they are just going to get mowed down.

And to be clear, my ideas are not necessarily original. I stole a lot of things from the various MMO's that I thought they did right. Like the gem slots is sort of a take on the orange gear from SWTOR, just expanded upon.

hometeam 11-21-2013 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pants (Post 10209340)
That's exactly how SWTOR was doing it. You had two different sets for PvP and PvE. The only thing is that there were people who did way more PvP than other people and were able to steamroll those who played less due to the gear difference. There is no easy fix for this, I don't think.

Actually, the easy fix is not to have a gear treadmill.

Like the way UO was/is still on free shards. All gear created equal = all skill

kaplin42 11-21-2013 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hometeam (Post 10209442)
Actually, the easy fix is not to have a gear treadmill.

Like the way UO was/is still on free shards. All gear created equal = all skill

Problem with that is, the pellet race. MMO's are built around the pellet system. You do a bunch of stuff, you get a reward, then you do a bunch more stuff, you get another reward. If there is no reward, no much reason to do the stuff.

hometeam 11-21-2013 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kaplin42 (Post 10209476)
Problem with that is, the pellet race. MMO's are built around the pellet system. You do a bunch of stuff, you get a reward, then you do a bunch more stuff, you get another reward. If there is no reward, no much reason to do the stuff.

Agreed.

With UO the system was get gold = invest in gold sink = gain power/prestige etc.

And with UO you lost your loot, so you had to keep doing stuff to get your gear back, so that you could go out and open world PvP and lose it again.

There will never be another UO, becuase of the way WoW has conditioned people, but it still has me playing 16 years later. So they did something right.


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