I suppose just aim for one bullet to the head and you don't have to worry about someone saying you used excessive force or suing you if they live.

What this guy did was clearly excessive force but I can't imagine how enraged I would be if people broke into my house.

Too bad this didn't happen in Missouri or his lawyers could go with the at least it wasn't a deer defense.

Sure, but you still have to shell out for a lawyer, and unless it's Your Cousin Vinnie, he won't represent you for free. Could still be life ruining.

Glad this didnt happen in Texas. This guy is just a guilty as Joe Horn (case that happened in Texas where he was acquitted)

Number of homes robbed by these pieces of ****ing dogshit since they got greased - ZERO.

:clap:

so much win!!

He'll be dead soon one way or the other. That said hope he spends the last of his murdering life behind bars.

I'm not shedding any tears for the kids. They were obviously trash. But this dude offed them. He should probably pay. But if he somehow gets over, I won't be too upset about that either.

I hope he beats the rap, just so we get to hear all you gushing vaginas cry about it some more.

It doesn't sound like the homeowners life was in danger. The kids didn't try to attack him. He was waiting for them and he was the one who initiated the attack and executed them.

Can he really use self-defense as an excuse?

I can't see how his actions blend in or comply with Minnesota law.

AFAIC, if somebody breaks into your home repeatedly, their safety is no guarantee. I realize my view doesn't necessarily line up with MN state law, but I have very little sympathy for home invaders. It's not like the old man is a danger to the general public. He's not out there shooting random people dead. He offed a couple of deadbeat criminals.

That's true. You gotta good point.

Im also in agreement with others on here in that he crossed the line by killing the two invaders. He could of handled this situation a lot better. Its just too bad.

I completely agree. It's difficult. I feel badly for the people presiding over this case up there. It's really a no-win.

If you're 555, I'm 666

An update from the future?

Shocked that he passed a mental evaluation if they gave him one

How's it feel to be a heretic?

The kids took a gamble and paid with their lives. I don't fault anyone for protecting their home. At the same time, because of the way he did it, I would not be opposed to beheading the SOB and if I'm the girls dad I am praying that they release him.

Yeah, if we lived in a state of nature, I might have some sympathy for the old dude. People break into your house, you have every right to defend yourself and your property.

But we don't live in a state of nature. You have an obligation to yourself to protect your home and your safety, but you do NOT have authority to punish these kids. You gave that up by living in America. Any force used passed what is absolutely necessary is vigilante justice and that makes you a CRIMINAL. And this is so far passed the line that I would call the guy a heinous criminal.

a) that's not a real law anywhere.

b) what's the evidence these particular kids did a prior break-in (at the shooter's house)?

Enjoy the 3 hots, cot, and unlimited rape!

Actually, you'd prolly be ok. I used to date a forensic analyst for the Highway Patrol. Most cops are apparently shit at collecting evidence, and I doubt they'd uncover evidence of your hypothetical execution.

Has anyone figured out what is going on with his eyes?

Cataracts?

+1 that would be too cool especially all the ones on twitter too saying they are going to move out of the USA lol.ROFL

Never said it was a law. Though, killing intruders in Texas is pretty kosher. I wasn't aware I had to present evidence. Every report I've read indicated there were multiple breakins by those kids but yeah... I didn't gather the evidence to prove it on CP. My bad.

Never said it was a law. Though, killing intruders in Texas is pretty kosher. I wasn't aware I had to present evidence. Every report I've read indicated there were multiple breakins by those kids but yeah... I didn't gather the evidence to prove it on CP. My bad.

In Tennessee we have the "Han Solo Law" where its totally OK to shoot first at a home invader.

update

POSTED: 11/25/2013 03:30:43 PM CST | UPDATED: 15 MIN. AGO


Byron Smith
LITTLE FALLS, Minn.—A judge has declined to dismiss a first-degree murder indictment against a Minnesota man accused of shooting two teens breaking into his house.
Byron David Smith, 64, is accused in the shooting deaths of Haile Kifer, 18, and her cousin Nick Brady, 16. A criminal complaint said Smith shot the teenagers several times as they walked down his basement stairs last Thanksgiving.

Smith's attorneys had argued that prosecutors made mistakes in presenting their case to the grand jury. They also argued that statements he made to police at the scene should be suppressed.

Judge Douglas P. Anderson denied the motions late Friday, the Star Tribune reported (http://strib.mn/1ekKhBq).

this is why you saying nothing to the police but "I felt in danger of my life and my lawyer will make any statements"

dude is a shitbag by all accounts for what he did, but just an example to never talk to the police in a situation like this, or any other possible felony.

Absolutely. The only reason this hasn't been dropped is it's an old crusty shooting kids. DA's suck.

That and the fact that he murdered them.

I'm all for shooting people but gosh...

Now I'm picturing all the dangerous old people that shouldn't be issued drivers licenses and still are... I certainly don't think you should take guns away from old people, but a check in on them every once in a while with a psych eval or even a basic firearms test wouldn't be too extraordinary to ask.

Yea, not so much in this case.
These kids didn’t die right way, they were injured but still breathing when he dragged them to the center of the basement floor and killed them execution style. He freely admitted as much which is the part of the police report the defense wants suppressed.

Well there's that...

The guy's a ****ing lunatic and a murderer.

I'm all for gun rights and defense of the home. I have a .40 caliber in the nightstand for just such an occasion. But this guy went way WAY over the line and should absolutely have to answer for it.

Yeah...the part where he executed them well after he was in any danger had nothing to do with it.

Obligatory Where are Al Jessie Holder and Obama on this???????????

Yeah, no.

First kill was justified. Caught in the legs coming down the stairs, then boom. One to the face when he hits the floor. Theres no premeditation on that one, its just reacting.

The girl, he flat out murdered. Shot her, she fell down the stairs and when he went to fire again, his gun jammed and she laughed. She didn't have a weapon to threaten him with. A solid rifle butt to the noggin would have subdued her and he was perfectly safe. Cops come collect her ass, sorry bout your dumbass cousin.

Instead, he grabs another gun and shoots her several times. Then, still alive and gasping for air, she's dragged over by the boy and shot under the chin to be "finished off".

There's no self defense there.

He should be charged with the murder of the girl.

Guess they broke into the wrong damn rec room...:shake:

don't get it twisted / Herm
I'm not saying the dude was in the right whatsoever; I'm merely saying to never talk to the cops. It would have been obvious to the Cops what had happened, but you still never talk.

I'm still really puzzled about why the girl would laugh at him, after already being shot multiple times.

"I've sent kids younger than you to the gas chamber. Didn't want to do it, felt I owed it to them"

I just don't buy it. Maybe a gurgle.

Shock/Hysterics

If she did, which I doubt, she was probably high as hell or hysterical.

She was on some pretty serious drugs.

LMAO

Don't want to be systematically executed??!!

Don't break into somebody's basement!!

Leave it to Big Doody to come up with some bullshit, he-man take.

Seems like if you dont break into people's houses your chances of getting shot considerably decrease

According to who? I hadn't seen that..

Original thought.

That's all this guy was doing. Just shooting a couple of home intruders because he feared for his life.

He shot a crack whore intruder, just to watch her die. When he gets thrown into the St Paul Prison, hes going to hang his head and cry. *GuitarRiff*

I'm moving in a different direction than the conversation to which your post was responding, but I'll point out that if I shot an intruder in my house I'd assume I was in danger from that point on. They know where I live and presumably they're very unhappy with me shooting them. If they're just arrested for burglary they'll be out of jail in 24 hours.

I hear what you're saying. Not sure that gives you the right to execute them.

Alas, the rules on self defense require that you be in fear of imminent bodily harm.

Concern that someone would break out of jail, come back to your house and exact revenge for you shooting them in the break in do not qualify as imminent.

The guy murdered at least one of them. Frankly, I think you could get 2 counts to stick if you worked at it.

You guys need to stop playing armchair judge and get to the heart of the issue.

We have to determine what to ban. Ban basements? A good start. Ban Cousins? Possibly. Ban being old? I like the thought until I'm 62. Ban laughing? Maybe.

Tiny evel-love the pic of the tiny Evel. Classic.

I hate big...uh...something?

Yeah, you can't execute them, but I could see someone making a convincing argument that the fifth shot was necessary because they were still moving and it looked like they were reaching for a gun. Assuming of course that the fifth shot wasn't behind the ear or something.

No on involved was black - which is why this isn't in the DC forum.

The police would have figured it out man. They can spot executions over self defense.

This.

When you break into people's homes you beg for bad $3it to happen.

Did he have to kill them? No.

They broke in and got a metric ****-ton more crazy than they planned on.

Is breaking into anything, anywhere, risking your life?

Abso-****ing-lutely...

Well and the track from where you dragged her into the living room and put another pill into her may also be a giveaway...

That's why you shoot to kill right from the get go

Seems like he didn't have much trouble with basic firearms operation.

I want a DMV kind of test.

"If you are sitting in your basement at night and kids come walking down the stairs do you...

A. Shoot to kill
B. Shoot to maim
C. Signal left

It's people like you who cause our taxes to go up. Please commit a felony.

It doesn't have to be expensive. Just make a website they all have to sign up with.

Please. They already have drivers license tests and somehow Asian women still drive.

Ouch.

You've got a point.

HAHAHAHAHA - walked right into that one.

I forget I'm asian sometimes. Usually when I'm around men I'm taller than.

LMAO

Heh. I'll bet you're through dating musclebound gorillas.

This would be no big deal back in the day. You enter somebodies home to steal from them, you get shot. Yeah yeah yeah, kids will be kids. But men will be men. You break into my house and and try to steal from me? Nope, sorry. Maybe the extra shot was excessive, maybe it wasn't. I wasn't there, and nobody was.

You know it.

I haven't had to diffuse an unnecessary brawl in years. Or smuggle Nubian.

Trial will begin April 14th. He has plead not guilty.

link
http://www.startribune.com/local/blogs/241734121.html

update:
trial starts tomorrow

http://www.startribune.com/local/255041461.html

today's report
http://www.twincities.com/localnews/...s-deaths-begin


LITTLE FALLS, Minn. -- The day after a Minnesota man killed two teens who entered his home, he matter-of-factly described the shootings in chilling detail, telling authorities he finished off one teen with a shot under her chin because a .22-caliber "doesn't go through bone very well," according to an audiotaped interview played in court Monday.

Byron Smith, 65, of Little Falls, is charged with first-degree premeditated murder in the slayings of 17-year-old Nick Brady and 18-year-old Haile Kifer on Thanksgiving Day 2012. The killings rocked the small central Minnesota city of about 8,000 and stirred debate about how far people can go in defending their homes.

Prosecutors said during opening statements that Smith planned the killings and was lying in wait in his basement.


Smith's attorney said his client was terrified after several increasingly violent break-ins and was hiding after he heard a window break and footsteps upstairs.
"He became frightened and scared to live in his own home," said Smith's attorney, Steve Meshbesher, later adding, "He began to wear a holster and pistol in his own house. That is how afraid he is, and became."

Assistant Washington County Attorney Brent Wartner told jurors that Smith thought a neighbor girl had been breaking into his home. On that day, he moved his truck away from his house, sat in his basement "and he waited," Wartner said.

"He's down in the basement, in a chair, tucked between two bookcases at the bottom of the stairs. He said he was down there reading a book ... with his Mini-14, a .22-caliber revolver, some energy bars and a bottle of water," Wartner said.

Under Minnesota law, a person may use deadly force to prevent a felony from taking place in one's home or dwelling, but authorities have said Smith crossed a line when he continued to shoot the teens after they were no longer a threat. The teens were not armed, but Smith told authorities he assumed they were -- and he thought they had taken guns from his house in a past burglary.


In the recordings, Smith can be heard politely recounting details to investigators. As the recordings were played Monday, Smith sat still at the defense table, at some points crying.

Smith told Morrison County Sheriff's Sgt. Jeremy Luberts that he was in his basement when he heard someone rattle his door, followed by footsteps on his deck and a shadow in a window.

"I'm getting seriously stressed because somebody wants in," he said. After a moment of silence, he said he heard a window break, and footsteps inside.

Smith told authorities he saw Brady begin descending the basement steps, then fired once Brady's hips came into view. Brady fell.

"He's looking, facing up at me, and I shoot him in the face. I want him dead," Smith told investigators.

Smith said he put Brady's body on a tarp so he wouldn't get blood into his carpet, dragged it into his workshop, reloaded his rifle and sat down.

Smith described feeling adrenaline, and "blood was pounding in my ears." He said he also felt he was being ganged up on, something he called one of his "red buttons." So when he saw Kifer come down the stairs minutes later, "I killed her too."

He shot her, and when he tried to "finish her off" his rifle jammed and she laughed, he said.

"I just pulled out the 22 and I shot her," he told authorities. He said he then pulled her into the workshop, but she was still gasping, so "I did a good, clean finishing shot and she gave out the death twitch."

He said he didn't call police because the teens were already dead and "just cause my Thanksgiving is screwed up I don't need to screw up yours." The next day, he asked a neighbor to call police.

Smith is a retired security engineer for the U.S. Department of State. Kifer and Brady were cousins. The two were well-known in the community, and both were involved in sports.

Court documents from another case show Brady had burglarized Smith's property at least twice in the months before he was killed.

J



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