Middle of the pack? "To Throw" means total time behind the LOS.
When you are a mobile QB who runs 3 times a game it is going to be higher. Even so it is lower than mostly all run threat QBs at the top of the list.

Look at Avg Time to Attempt. Quick, as expected with the offense KC schemed.

Look at the Sack Time. Lower and sometimes a lot lower than most of the scramble/run QBs.

Stop making up crap and educate yourself.

Andy Reid has NEVER held on to a quarterback too long.

While that's true, at some point here in KC, they're gonna have to show me.

So far they've done a great job at investing in the qb position with more total talent than we've had there in a while.

But it's all for naught if they don't find "the guy". Maybe they think they already have, I don't know

LOL

You were spouting the same bullshit in the offseason.

Then Alex got sacked another 45 times.

LOL LOL LOL

He has been an oft-sacked QB ever since Harbaugh "fixed" him. And I bet he takes another 40+ sacks next year!

LOL LOL LOL

I bet if you look at his sacks per pass attempt over the last 4 seasons he's probably in the top 5.

Dude...they are not going to restructure Smith's contract this off-season. He just signed the ****ing thing.

To quote Dane...

Jesus.

No receivers are ever open enough for Alex Smith.

No offensive line is ever good enough for Alex Smith.

And there are very few defenses that are stingy enough for him, too.

Alex averages taking one sack for every 11 pass attempts.

I wonder how that stacks up to other quarterbacks.

I'll have to find out...

He didn't seem to have a problem throwing to Avery, Kelce or Wilson.

Didn't read through the thread but when Smith lost Jenkins and avery it hamstrung him.

Give him some protection with the OL and some speed back at WR and yes he will be the QB we want.

Remember back to the 2nd half last year and the playoff game. He was hitting Wide receivers and still protecting the ball.

He has never proven this. The discrepancy in the WR numbers in SF during and after Smith and the WR numbers here before and during Smith illustrate that conclusively.

He's already been Neutered, no need to fix him.

They've picked up rookie QB's in each of the last two years and that's with Smith signing a new contract and bringing in Daniels.

Don't fall into the "But we gotta draft a QB in the first for it to count!!!!" bullshit that always gets thrown around here.

They are not sitting on their laurels. They'll pick a guy when the guy that they like is there and he's better than other guys on their board. That's about it. They aren't going to rush head long into the classic Chief's Planet philosophy of over drafting the QB position just to draft a guy at the QB position.

If this place was picking QB's, we'd have a roster of Jimmy Clausen, Mark Sanchez and Johnny Manziel.

"We shoulda drafted Bridgewater!!!! Oh noes!!! Because he was a QB on the board when we picked!!!! AAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!"

This place goes into total epic meltdown when anything but a QB is picked in the first three rounds.

Here's what I don't understand with this whole thing.

Andy Reid has never been ok with or had a qb play as scared as Alec smith does. What changed? Is he now ok with it?

He's always put good to great passing teams on the field, one way or another.

He can't he happy with a bottom of the league passing game, no?

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There's no amount of dysfunction elsewhere on the team that could divert some reeruns' eyes from their ridiculous obsession with QB grudges.

Alex is a young pup compared to Brady an Mannning and they made the playoffs. Alex can still be molded, formed and shaped like a piece of clay into the perfect QB.

That's bullshit and you know it.

When you pick up a guy like Jason Avant off the street in the middle of the season and he immediately looks like your best receiver on the team two days later, you know you got problems at the position.

When you insert Jeff Linkenbach into the starting lineup and he's immediately your best guard, you know you got problems at the position.

And I won't even get into the whole 11-5, 9-7 after the worst ten year stretch of football in the franchise's history.

Drew Brees instead of Trent Green?
Aaron Rodgers instead of DJ?
Joe Flacco over Glenn Dorsey or Brandon Albert?
Moving up a couple spots to draft Tanehill?
Taking Bridgewater over Dee Ford?

At one point, this team needs to grow some nuts and at least try.

If you played behind our OL wouldn't you play scared?

You wouldn't be fighting this fight if Alex didn't go to college in Utah.

At the time, I would still take dj.

Rodgers is Rodgers, but I don't think he'd have been what he is anywhere else. He had major overhauls in his game.

The others? Yeah, that sucks

He is what he is, and he will always be just that. There's no fixing him of that. You want him to be some fantasy football super stud QB? Go find Tony Gonzalez, TO, and Randy Moss in their primes, and then MAYBE he'll crack 4,000 yards with 300 TDs. Not before.


Watching Alex this past season made me wonder if Aaron Murray could conceivably do the things Alex did at the exact same level. I'd assume the interceptions would be higher, but in our Daboll-esque offense we ran, Murray could have done the same things. Hell, he was more of a gunslinger at Georgia than Alex has been here in two seasons. Just food for thought.

Jason Avant, best WR on the team:

2.6 catches per game, 11.7 yards per catch, 30.4 yards per game

If this were the first year of that, then yes

After that late hit by Von Miller, I'm not sure I could feel comfortable back there...but maybe that would change if you gave me 15 million dollars.

Yeah at no point did Jason avant ever look like our best wr.

Avant was never our best receiver, but he was a useful possession receiver.

No they don't. Reaching for a position just to have one isn't a good philosophy.

Nobody on this board wanted Flacco. Nobody on this board knew who ****ing Flacco was. The guy who was too pussy to try and tough it out at Pittsburgh, the guy who was back up to Tyler ****ing Palko, so he transfers to Delaware to jack up his stats? That guy?

DJ has been an All-Pro and one of the top three guys at his position over the past five years. We also now have the guy that went first overall in his draft class, the guy most teams had rated over Rogers.

Seriously...those are your examples of the guys we should have took? Lose draft picks for Tannehill? Take Bridgewater when we already had two backups on the roster in Daniel and Bray? (And they drafted Murray in that draft anyway - a guy people liked around here.) Brees? Really? You are going that far back? Shit, why not start bitching it up about passing on Jim Kelly for Blackledge while you are at it.

The only reason why people wanted those QBs was because we so desperately needed one at the time, but that's all that was available.

I have an immense amount of respect for franchises that take proactive approaches to their QBs. Like when the Packers transitioned from Favre to Rodgers. The Niners with Montana to Young. Hell, even Andy Reid when he was in Philadelphia, transitioning away from McNabb with a QB he thought was promising while also throwing in Vick as insurance in case Kolb wasn't the guy.

Alex will be 31 and has no testicles. It's time for us to take the same approach instead of watching him get his brains bashed in and saying, "Uhp, but there aren't any good QBs for us to draft this year! Better trade for another team's backup!"

It's either that or we sit around bitching about how we're a "snake-bitten franchise" and there just aren't any Andrew Lucks available to us when we need them!

When he won the 2004 National Championship:

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That's 10 years and about 500 sacks ago.

He's not that guy anymore

Bridgewater would have accomplished nearly identical on-the-field results as Dee Ford in his rookie year.

Dude, they are doing it. Bray, Murray. I was ****ing livid when they drafted Murray. Wasting a ****ing draft pick on a guy who was no more than Chase Daniel's clone. But yet the picked the guy.

Like I said, when they like a guy, and he's on their board above the other guys, they'll take that QB. Neither Reid nor Dorsey have ever just sat on the position.

The trade for Smith was proactive. We've gone, in two scant seasons, from the worst team in the league to having back to back winning seasons for the first time in nearly 20 ****ing years. Coaching has a lot to do with that, but so does the QB position. The signing of Daniel was proactive. The signing of Bray was proactive. The wasting of a draft pick for Murray was proactive.

It will happen and thank the little baby Jesus they aren't going to reach for the position to do it so we end up with some Chiefs Planet All-Pro like Jimmy Clausen or Mark Sanchez.

11-5.

9-7.

With what was not very arguably the worst WR and OL corps in the NFL.

He is that guy.

Still.

The Chiefs are just ****ing pussies.

It is what it is.

Tell me history says different.

Wins and or losses isn't a justifiable way to rate qb play.

If that's the only thing you're basing this off of, no, he's not that guy anymore

I wish he was that guy. We need more gunslinger

Go start another thread about drafting some linemen from Utah in the first.

Pussy.

I listed those guys because they are Super Bowl champions that we passed on...or are very talented young quarterbacks we weren't interested in.

I know you don't want to hear it, but Alex Smith is 31 and is coming off a bad year.

You upgrade just two positions on this offensive line and give this team just one WR who can break off his foot in a defenses ass when coming off the line and hitting his breaks, you will see that guy.

Three position upgrades and this team is in the Super Bowl.

9-7 and beating the best teams in the NFC (Seattle) and AFC (Patriots) isn't a bad year.

9-7 with the toughest schedule in the NFL isn't a bad year.

9-7 with the worst WR and youngest OL group in the NFL isn't a bad year.

I'm not sure how damaged your short term memory is, but if you look back on the ten years prior to Smith and Reid showing up, I don't have any clue as to how you could call the 2014 Chiefs season a "bad year."

The chiefs didn't have a bad year.

Alex smith didn't have a bad year. He had his normal year which proved to not be good enough.

A good quarterback in a pass first offense with a QB guru should never end up with the lowest rated passing game in the NFL.

Lets not act as if the skill position players are "worst in the NFL"

Bowe is a good receiver
Kelce is a top 5 tight end
Wilson and Thomas offer the offense lots of speed and playmaking ability.
Charles and Davis are probably the best running back duo in the NFL.

Teams stacked the box to shut down the run and flood the short zones to eliminate YAC and were literally giving us the deep routes and Alex didn't know what to do.

So, he ended with the leagues worst passing attack and set and NFL record for futility in an era where the rules are slanted to make it easier to throw the ball.

You know what? I've been "seeing that guy" for decades now.

**** that guy.

If Andy Reid really considered getting rid of Alex Smith he wouldn't have signed him to that contract, nor would he have sought out offensive players who do almost all of their damage horizontally.

He knows Smith's limitations and has actively embraced them. He's here until 2018 at the earliest.

What happened Boss? Did your Cheetos eating pals make fun of you 'cause your Madden team didn't put up passing TD's?

Dwayne Bowe is a good receiver in the right system. He's mediocre at best in this system because he runs shit routes, has bad hands and doesn't know where he's at on the field. Right now, he's the single biggest detriment to this team in terms of getting a better guy on the field and tying up massive monetary resources that could be better allocated.

Kelce has the potential to be a Top 3 TE in the NFL. Right now, he's lazy with his technique and lacks serious focus.

Wilson and Thomas are rookies. Thomas is too light in the ass to be anything other than a PR/KR and gadget offensive guy unless he figures out how to run routes like Jackson or Beckham. Wilson is a track guy from a small school. He didn't show dick last season.

Like I said, shit WR's and shit/young OL. However...

9-7 against the hardest schedule in the NFL in 2014 with wins over the two best teams in each division.

That's progress, significant progress, against what this team was and what it accomplished in a short two seasons ago.

No you haven't.

I'm with you. **** that guy. Croyle, Huard, Palko, et al.

Smith is not that guy.

Give this team those three positions and we, along with the Colts, are the team to beat in the AFC for the next three to five years. (And, frankly, I think we are better than the Colts.)

They tried to sign Desean Jackson and Emmanuel Sanders after signing Donnie Avery the year before.

They also signed Wilson who is a speed burner, too...as is Thomas.

I wish I knew how to move a video from my genie to the computer so I could play the video from after the hey last year with Andy talking about Alex and throwing deep and how important it is to his ability to keep his job as a starting NFL quarterback.

Iirc it's either the pregame or during halftime.

No.

Yes.

Smith is a scared, heaping bag of dicks. Defending him at this point is outright comical.

Sac can be very silly when talking about Utah players

It is when you could have gone 12-4 by beating the Titans, Raiders and Stanton-led Cardinals.

Alex is what he is.

There's no "fixing" anything.

You either build around him (huge YAC guys) or move on...

Well, we can all agree on this - 2015 is the third year for Alex in this system. If he doesn't show marked improvement this coming season along with winning in the playoffs, it cannot be argued that this trade was a waste of resources and time and we are worse off for making the trade in the first place.

We have, now documented, the worst WR's in the history of the league in YAC.

The worst, hands down.

KC's line is dog$3it. I thought it would be bottom 5 but Alex scrambled his ass off and we managed to only be the 7th most sacked team in the NFL.

Pay for a vet HOG or two and roll the dice in the draft (3rd round sounds about right) on a WR...

That's fair.

If we don't move forward offensively next year, someone needs to eat the shit for it. If not Alex, then who? Dorsey and or Reid for not getting the proper pieces around their seemingly limited QB?

I'm not really very interested in what Andy Reid says. I'm far more interested in what he does.

I seem to remember a murderer being part of the "Right 53." Talk is ****ing cheap.

I'm still not sure that part of this uber-conservative style is by design through Reid.


The accuracy on deeper passes can get a little better through practice but it's not going to ever be great.

Get enough talent on the team and he will look much better (see Patriots MNF game for proof).

Russell Wilson is good, but he doesn't even put up great numbers. His supporting cast helps him out.

This team will win 10 games and be back in the playoffs next year and we'll win our first playoff game sooner rather than later. Dorsey is going to bring some massive changes to this offense.

Get the OL fixed and add some more speed on the outside and we're in business.

Yeah, I remember when Utah was named the National Champ.

LMAO

Does anyone here really expect marked improvement?

In his tenth NFL season, is there any brave soul that wants to step forward and proclaim that this will be the year Alex takes that next step?

That snuck past me. Was that the year USC had to relinquish the title?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_Fiesta_Bowl

NO MENTION OF NATIONAL CHAMPS

Also today I learned - Urban Meyer QBs in the NFL are ass.

I wonder if there is more than one person in Utah that claims that title.

Lol, more than likely. But nowhere else.

Meh. They're still Boise State's bitch.

Ok, that is some interesting data, and if you look beyond the sufrace completely supports the idea that Alex Smith holds on to the ball too long and supports the supposition that a lot of the sacks he takes are caused by him and not the offensive line.

First, let's look at the sack rates in the first 2.5 seconds. These sacks can be put fully on the OL, since they are getting beat so quickly and the QB doesn't have a prayer. Alex's sack rate is about 1.6% in the first 2.5 seconds, compared to a league average of 1.97%. He doesn't have anything close to the worst situation in the NFL in this regard, even if you allow for the fact that he uses his legs to bail him out of some situations. His passer rating in cases where he gets rid of the ball in 2.5 seconds or less is 103.4, compared to an NFL average of 96.8, again better than average.

Now let's look at what happens when he holds the ball longer than 2.5 seconds. We've all seen Alex cock his arm to throw the ball (presumably because he momentarily thought he saw an opportunity) then pull the ball down. Alex's sack rate after 2.5 seconds jumps up to 16.7%, compared to a league average of 10.5%. The blame on these sacks goes increasingly on the QB. For example, when playing behind the same OL, Nick Foles had a sack rate after 2.5 seconds of 4.2% while Mark Sanchez's sack rate is more than twice as high at 9.8%. Likewise Kurt Counsins' greater than 2.5 second sack rate was much lower than RGIIIs and Charlie Whitehurst's was much lower than the other Tennessee QBs. So many of the sacks that Alex took fall squarely on his shoulders.

And it's not like Smith is trading off sacks for better opportunities to throw the ball. Smith's passer rating when he holds on to the ball for 2.5 seconds or more drops to 76.3. compared to a league average of 80.8 in this situation. As he holds on the to ball longer, he gets sacked more than other NFL QBs and he becomes a worse QB than other NFL QBs. Bad things happen when he holds on to the ball. He does not see the field to find opportunities, he does not make things happen. He is best when he makes a quick read and dumps the ball, which is one of the things we criticize about him. But when he tries to do more than that, bad things happen. More than other QBs, he needs to make it a priority to get rid of the ball quickly in order to be successful.

Not all QBs follow this pattern. Ben Roethlisberer, Tony Romo, and and Aaron Rodgers all have QB ratings well over 110 when they hold the ball for more than 2.5 seconds. Andrew Luck, Peyton Manning, Drew Brees, Eli Manning, and Ryan Fitzpatrick all have ratings over 90 when they hold the ball. Several QBs have a higher rating when they hold the ball than when they throw it quickly. They can afford to hold on the ball.

Amazing, isn't it?

To think that a team who is, by Chiefs Planet standards, beyond the pale of shitty, quarterbacked by a stiff who can't throw, coached by a corpulent reerun and managed by a hack who has no nose for talent, had a winning record with the toughest schedule in the NFL, beat the two best teams in the entire league and should have had home field advantage throughout the playoffs!

That's actually a very good point C.E. and shows how close this team actually is to being an elite NFL team.

Three positional upgrades and those are indeed wins which gives this team a significant opportunity to waltz right into the Super Bowl, which should be expected in Year Three of a new regime that knows what they are doing.

I think that the Chiefs have made all the right steps in terms of progression under the Dorsey/Reid/Smith era. In Year One, they've proven they weren't the horrible team that they showed in 2012. In Year Two, they proved that wasn't a fluke by compiling a winning record against the toughest schedule in the NFL and beating the two best teams in the league. Year Three should see that next step of getting into the playoffs and winning.

I can't possibly imagine why any Chief's fan, no matter how much of a pessimistic anus they were, couldn't look objectively at the beginning of the Dorsey/Reid/Smith Era and be happy with the progression.

Reading this thread just proves that Reid really isn't that good of a coach. Smith is regressing is the easiest offense to run in the NFL.

Reids hand picked qb? LOL.

Worse off?

What should they (Dorsey/Reid) have done/what would you have suggested they have done that would have resulted in a better situation than what the team current is experiencing?

Link?

Actually building a team that can contend for championships 3+ years down the line from when they took over in 2013 rather than the constant roster hole patching that only ensures a .500 record and wildcard round losses.

That's an excellent point. I just hope he does it again when we make the playoffs next year

Isn't that good of a coach? That's asinine. Reid is damn good coach and we're lucky to have him. We won 9 games with a terrible oline and WR core that caught 0 TDs. And we played a hard schedule and beat some good teams.

Toughest schedule in the NFL, bottom 5 OL and WR corps and we still had a winning season and beat the 2 best teams in the league.

Your stupidity is as expected as your posting.

1st year - build to win immediately
2nd year - rebuild

:cuss:

Most of the key issues with this year's team were known going into free agency and draft. Dorsey fail to address them.

If he had just handled OG and WR successfully we would of made the playoffs.

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And that Utah team was a significantly better team than the Ohio State team that just won the NC. Just saying...

Something else that's crazy. People deep throat Rivers and the Chargers so much. Their offense only scored one more TD than we did last year.

The results speak for themselves.

Zero playoff wins in three appearances since 2008 and his winning percentage has fallen by practically 10%. Further, his teams fall apart in the second half of the season.

2013 is the high water mark for Reid.

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